When the Racing Phoenix arises from the ashes, what form should it take

[curious]

54 minutes ago, Freda said:

If they have been paid as per directed, yes, they should. 

But, were the codes paid?.

I mean, if the cupboard is bare, how do you feed the troops?

Hard to know isn't it, with not a breath from the Minister, RITA or NZTR other than the shutdown regulations. Any coms from the likes of the CJC about an operational plan for survival and resumption? They'll be going backwards pretty fast if they are still paying staff with no revenue?

[Freda]

1 hour ago, curious said:

Hard to know isn't it, with not a breath from the Minister, RITA or NZTR other than the shutdown regulations. Any coms from the likes of the CJC about an operational plan for survival and resumption? They'll be going backwards pretty fast if they are still paying staff with no revenue?

No, nothing.  Got the March acct pretty smartly though.

 

[curious]

2 hours ago, Freda said:

No, nothing.  Got the March acct pretty smartly though.

 

They probably don't have much else to do?

[Hesi]

From Bernard's Blog

Rather than dwell on the downside of this, I believe our industry should be focusing on the opportunity the lockdown has given us to reset our industry.  We can use this as an opportunity to do things differently, change things up and create a model which will sustain us into the future.

We already have a team working on various permutations of what a resumption of racing might look like.  There are some interesting ideas being thrown around and everything will be considered.

While the group we have put together does possess extensive experience and knowledge, we also acknowledge that no one has a mortgage on good ideas.  There will be industry participants out there who are also pondering racing’s future. If you have any thoughts on how you think racing could restructure itself as we rebuild from the impact of COVID-19 then please share them via email with Dan.Smith@nztr.co.nz

[Hesi]

Feel free to put up your thoughts here, and anything of merit will get emailed through, alternatively send it through directly

One question I had, say Racing does not get underway again till Aug 1.  That will be about 20 mil of stake money not used by the industry.

Does NZTR retain that, or do NZRB hold it?

[Hesi]

Anyone know the answer to this?

[curious]

1 April 2020 Dear Racing Participants and Owners On behalf of NZTR, we want to provide you an update on the work we are doing in these unprecedented times. The New Zealand racing industry, like many businesses, faces critical challenges as a consequence of COVID-19.  The NZTR Board has met regularly over the past two weeks discussing the lockdown, the economic and social impacts, what cuts we can make, and how do we return to racing.  There has been significant work undertaken by an industry working group around what format a return to racing might take. Following an NZTR Board meeting last night and based on the assumption of a four-week lockdown, we are targeting a return to racing on 1 July at a reduced network of venues.  We will need to be flexible as each region comes out of lockdown and with the possibility that alert levels might fluctuate. An indicative four-month calendar has been developed and the key components are as follows: ·         If training is able to resume in May, we anticipate trialling in late June with race dates from 1 July ·         Building from a single meeting per week in each region in July ·         A focus on racing near the horse population in early months and building to wider venue use by late Spring ·         Incentives being explored to get horses to the races rather than multiple trials ·         The removal of nomination and acceptance fees during the initial period ·         A programme that needs to be flexible, with races over shorter distances initially ·         No reduction to the minimum stake but a flatter stake model across the board initially to ensure wider distribution of funds to owners ·         A return to jumps racing is likely for Northern region but unlikely for South due to likely travel restrictions ·         The scheduling of Group and Listed races and reviewing the pattern has been discussed and the recognition that travel restrictions will require a new way of thinking ·         Data is important and a team from NZTR’s National Racing Bureau will be making contact with trainers over the coming weeks. Information on the number of horses potentially able to enter work will play a part in forming the programming of races when we resume.   The full impact on stake allocations will be known once we have the full picture from RITA and the Government. In addition to the measures and activity referred to above NZTR: ·         Has reduced payroll and contractor costs by 20% since the shutdown of racing including the salaries of Board members by 100% and the CEO by 25% ·         Commenced the development of enhancing the protocols and actions required when a return to racing and training is possible under the Government Alert level system ·         Worked with RITA and the Government in providing data and information on how NZTR wants racing to resume with an appropriate funding model ·         Conducted phone and video conferences with stakeholders and club representatives to provide information and responding to queries in these uncertain times. NZTR’s priority is to recommence racing as soon as possible to maintain employment within our sport and to distribute much needed funds for our participants. We are also very aware that you are all working hard to maintain equine welfare at the highest level. We recognise that people may be under considerable stress as they consider the future of their business and urge you to make use of the government financial assistance packages.  The link to the information required can be found here.  It is also important to look after your own wellbeing, if you feel you are not coping you can call or text 1737 free anytime, 24/7 to speak to a trained counsellor. Please follow the protocols put in place by the Government under Alert level 4 over the coming weeks. Stay at home, obey social distancing and wash your hands!  This is vitally important to allow us to get through the lockdown period and allow the country and our industry to get through this. On behalf of NZTR, we sincerely hope that you all remain safe and healthy throughout these strange and uncertain times. Yours in Racing,

 

Dr Alan Jackson Chairman

Bernard Saundry Chief Executive

[mardigras]

A good opportunity to really bring about some decent changes.

" No reduction to the minimum stake but a flatter stake model across the board initially to ensure wider distribution of funds to owners"

Initially was unnecessary. A flatter model and a model without contrived tiers would have been a good start. And changes to the handicapping system whereby a horse is handicapped on performance, not on a computer adjustment. At least doing that would allow them to race lower performing single win horses at a different 'class' level to higher performing single win horses - if there is that variance (which there is). In doing that, you are then able to introduce a form of tiering of stakes - based on horse quality, not based on what day of the week it is.

Edited April 1, 2020 by mardigras

[Freda]

You do realise,  that this is all contingent upon getting a Govt bailout to start up.

[mardigras]

25 minutes ago, Freda said:

You do realise,  that this is all contingent upon getting a Govt bailout to start up.

Start with ribbons and work up from there??

[curious]

 

3 hours ago, mardigras said:

Start with ribbons and work up from there??

Why not? Surely they can get enough bets on one meeting a week to buy some red ribbons? I know a manufacturer of the nice rosette style ones that could be attached to the bridle and I'm sure they will be looking for business after the lockdown is over.

I'm sure every other business would like a bailout from government as well but can't imagine that any business or industry will have a chance beyond what is provided for all. Think they'll have to go with what they have. Some community clubs may be able to raise some local sponsorship to help out as well.

[Midnight Caller]

Hesi, answer to your thread heading is...the Pheonix is streamlined as much possible for the good of the sport.This situation is going to affect everyone involved in the industry and coming out the other side,major cuts have to happen. I feel this is an opportunity  for the community clubs around the country to break away and form their own tier of racing if they choose or fold! It will be complicated,but most (if not all )of these clubs have  good racing people involved within the clubs and I believe the local community will support these clubs 100%.

Edited April 1, 2020 by Midnight Caller

[Freda]

I think travel restrictions would preclude that happening short term ,   and going forward, if you are not part of the ' system '   I doubt clubs would be allowed to operate. 

Nice thought though.

[Maximus]

On 3/31/2020 at 10:08 PM, Hesi said:

From Bernard's Blog

Rather than dwell on the downside of this, I believe our industry should be focusing on the opportunity the lockdown has given us to reset our industry.  We can use this as an opportunity to do things differently, change things up and create a model which will sustain us into the future.

We already have a team working on various permutations of what a resumption of racing might look like.  There are some interesting ideas being thrown around and everything will be considered.

While the group we have put together does possess extensive experience and knowledge, we also acknowledge that no one has a mortgage on good ideas.  There will be industry participants out there who are also pondering racing’s future. If you have any thoughts on how you think racing could restructure itself as we rebuild from the impact of COVID-19 then please share them via email with Dan.Smith@nztr.co.nz

yep...send all your best industry-rescuing ideas free of charge to someone you've ever heard of at NZTR who will probably either ignore it or claim it as their own.

[Midnight Caller]

2 hours ago, Freda said:

I think travel restrictions would preclude that happening short term ,   and going forward, if you are not part of the ' system '   I doubt clubs would be allowed to operate. 

Nice thought though.

With a six month break this is the perfect time to put the wheels in motion and Petone need to move quickly for all involved in the industry. 

My thoughts were that they are probably going to do away with these clubs anyway!So go it alone, oncourse only or a token purchase system to get around restrictions. Break the shackles and these clubs and communities will thrive!

Just my opinion. 

[Turny]

Will speed up the closure of courses

I can see over the next 12 months it will all be at Wingatui, Riccarton, Trentham, Awapuni, Te Rapa and Ellerslie. 

Reduced travel, where the horses are trained, where attendees are, reduced ongoing covid risk. 

Can see only 6 races a day initially with no public then after 6 months may loosen up. 

Can't see any public on course for 12 months at least

This covid thing has a very long tail, and my regular trips to Aussie for Premier racing days are gone till 2022 as I can't see international travel for 18 months minimum

Edited April 2, 2020 by Turny

[curious]

2 hours ago, Turny said:

Will speed up the closure of courses

I can see over the next 12 months it will all be at Wingatui, Riccarton, Trentham, Awapuni, Te Rapa and Ellerslie. 

Reduced travel, where the horses are trained, where attendees are, reduced ongoing covid risk. 

Can see only 6 races a day initially with no public then after 6 months may loosen up. 

Can't see any public on course for 12 months at least

This covid thing has a very long tail, and my regular trips to Aussie for Premier racing days are gone till 2022 as I can't see international travel for 18 months minimum

Think that's a fair estimate though can't see Trentham or Ellerslie in the mix. Need to stick closer to the horse populations.

Edited April 2, 2020 by curious

[Turny]

True curious, we are in very serious times our racing world is in for massive change, after 65 years of interest I have walked I no longer care 

[Hesi]

I picked a couple of things out of the 2018 NZTR Annual report

TAB OUTSOURCING

NZTR has always believed that an outsourcing model that operates in Australia – which should not be confused with selling the TAB – would provide the economies of scale the NZRB has lacked and provide substantial financial benefits.

The NZTR view had also been supported by the Deloitte Report – which had analysed potential gains from forming a partnership with Australian and international wagering partners.

The case for outsourcing was boosted when changes to Australian gaming legislation barred the NZRB from taking bets from Australia. This has significantly restricted our exposure to the $30bn Australian wagering market.

 

[mardigras]

2 minutes ago, Hesi said:

I picked a couple of things out of the 2018 NZTR Annual report

TAB OUTSOURCING

NZTR has always believed that an outsourcing model that operates in Australia – which should not be confused with selling the TAB – would provide the economies of scale the NZRB has lacked and provide substantial financial benefits.

The NZTR view had also been supported by the Deloitte Report – which had analysed potential gains from forming a partnership with Australian and international wagering partners.

The case for outsourcing was boosted when changes to Australian gaming legislation barred the NZRB from taking bets from Australia. This has significantly restricted our exposure to the $30bn Australian wagering market.

 

The comment relating to 'an outsourcing model that operates in Australia' is incongruous. Since they don't operate an outsourced model. And they do operate a model where the TAB has been sold. Who knew? Are these people seriously this thick? Now or even two years ago. VIC TAB has not been outsourced by VIC government. The VIC government owns zero % of TABCORP (unless they have bought shares on the stock exchange). 

[Hesi]

If you look at NZTR, they get about 80 mil in 2020 to dish out in stakes.  Their costs to administer racing in NZ amount to about 10% of that.

You can hardly call them a cost burdened organisation

The problem has always been with the NZRB and it's ballooning excesses.  NZTR recognise that in trying to get outsourcing moving, they even commissioned a report by Deloittes.

So whatever we see put in place, the money generating side(wagering), must be a lot more productive and efficient.

The whole thing seems to have been lost in a myriad of committees, perhaps this broadsde will shake things up.

No point having a reduced scale version of the excesses we have seen.  As much of each dollar wagered as possible, must be returned to racing, not the pockets of a burdening bureaucracy

[Midnight Caller]

It would be interesting see the breakdown of expenditure in the last three colomns!

[mardigras]

13 minutes ago, Hesi said:

If you look at NZTR, they get about 80 mil in 2020 to dish out in stakes.  Their costs to administer racing in NZ amount to about 10% of that.

You can hardly call them a cost burdened organisation

The problem has always been with the NZRB and it's ballooning excesses.  NZTR recognise that in trying to get outsourcing moving, they even commissioned a report by Deloittes.

So whatever we see put in place, the money generating side(wagering), must be a lot more productive and efficient.

The whole thing seems to have been lost in a myriad of committees, perhaps this broadsde will shake things up.

No point having a reduced scale version of the excesses we have seen.  As much of each dollar wagered as possible, must be returned to racing, not the pockets of a burdening bureaucracy

I don't disagree that NZRB costs are excessive. I disagree that NZTR claim the Australian model is an outsourced model. It isn't.

Aside from that, selling imo has far greater potential than outsourcing. Outsourcing will have costs associated with running the business. And costs associated with outsourcing. i.e. - they will want to make money from being the outsourced provider - over and above the costs of generating the revenue. So if NZRB costs to generate the revenue are $200m, and TABCORP can do it for $100m (saving $100m), TABCORP will want a fee (since they want to make money). They may want that fee to be $80m (or whatever it may be). So they may say to NZRB, we'll run your business for $180m. And what will NZRB do? NZ will be faced with continuing to pay them essentially an outsourcing fee (with built in profit) for delivering the service (as any outsourcee does). And that fee is going to come off first as I doubt TABCORP would sign up to offering a service without their fee being at the top of the list. If there isn't $180m of net revenue, TABCORP will probably still take their $180m for service delivery - and NZ Racing/NZRB will be left with a debt.

Edited April 2, 2020 by mardigras

[Hesi]

You know the intricacies better than most Mardi, I'd just like to see something put in place, where as I have said, as much as possible of every dollar wagered is returned to racing.  It is like one of those charities, that when you delve a bit deeper and find 93 cents of every dollar donated goes towards running the charity

How they use it, such as the allocation of stake money, is another topic for discussion

[mardigras]

10 hours ago, Hesi said:

You know the intricacies better than most Mardi, I'd just like to see something put in place, where as I have said, as much as possible of every dollar wagered is returned to racing.  It is like one of those charities, that when you delve a bit deeper and find 93 cents of every dollar donated goes towards running the charity

How they use it, such as the allocation of stake money, is another topic for discussion

Another issue with outsourcing will be things like infrastructure. An outsourced partner running NZRB equipment is less likely to achieve major savings (especially in the short term). Savings are likely to be made once TABCORP (if that was the outsource partner), was delivering the service by way of their own infrastructure. 

So what happens to the $50m betting platform? Among other things.

Who pays to upgrade every single TAB/pub-tab/self service kiosk with the infrastructure that works with TABCORP infrastructure?

If the outsource model is to persist with the NZRB platform, the degree of cost efficiencies reduces. There would still be some. But they would still be required to run disparate systems.

When you shift from an inefficient model of the industry gets the leftovers (the current model), to a model where the industry gets some of the leftovers (and hope that the overall leftovers are bigger due to efficiencies), you have to be cognisant of the need for that organisation to make a profit in their own right. So they need to be able to make savings GREATER than the profit they want to take, or the industry will be in the same position (or worse), in the short term anyway.

This is in line with a discussion I had years ago with Colin Whiteman. He suggested it was impossible for a privatised TAB to return the same level of $ per betting $ to the industry, compared to the NZ TAB. I'd imagine (or I certainly hope so), he has changed his thoughts on that.

It's going to be interesting to see the direction taken.