Hesi Posted January 14, 2022 Share Posted January 14, 2022 What is it with this horse, 4 runs in this prep, for a last and 3 second to lasts Each time we get a form comment, that the horse is building fitness towards another Wellington Cup Are they even allowed to do this, presenting a horse that is not fit. Rules of racing in NZ are not specific 636 (1) A person: (a) shall not run a horse, or cause or permit a horse to be run, other than on its merits; Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mardigras Posted January 14, 2022 Share Posted January 14, 2022 I think they can do that here - as long as the horse runs on its merits. We don't have the rule that you can't bring a horse to the races for the purposes of training it (as far as I am aware). That is absurd to not have that rule - as that is what punters would want to know that the horse is fit for the purposes of racing and that the endeavour is to try and win the race. It doesn't mean the horse's fitness can't be improved on - it means you aren't using the race simply as a means to improve its fitness for future races. Which is done by a multitude of horses here (stayers resuming, jumpers) Even doing things like running a horse in new gear to 'train' it to run a different way - without the intention of trying to win the race, is against the rules of racing elsewhere. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hesi Posted January 14, 2022 Author Share Posted January 14, 2022 The black art of training a horse I note it's campaign last season was totally different, with good form from the start in Aug through till it winning the Wellington Cup and St Leger Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mardigras Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 What a hoot. Hope you took some of the BSP $37.1 Hesi 🙂 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hesi Posted January 15, 2022 Author Share Posted January 15, 2022 I would say there are a few that made a killing off the horse Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mardigras Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 5 minutes ago, Hesi said: I would say there are a few that made a killing off the horse Although starting at that price on betfair with limited liquidity - not many did there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
curious Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 11 hours ago, mardigras said: I think they can do that here - as long as the horse runs on its merits. We don't have the rule that you can't bring a horse to the races for the purposes of training it (as far as I am aware). That is absurd to not have that rule - as that is what punters would want to know that the horse is fit for the purposes of racing and that the endeavour is to try and win the race. It doesn't mean the horse's fitness can't be improved on - it means you aren't using the race simply as a means to improve its fitness for future races. Which is done by a multitude of horses here (stayers resuming, jumpers) Even doing things like running a horse in new gear to 'train' it to run a different way - without the intention of trying to win the race, is against the rules of racing elsewhere. Not so sure but it's never enforced to my knowledge. HORSE WELFARE [Amended 1 August 2017]650 (1) The Trainer or any other person in charge of a horse that is to be brought to theRacecourse or is at the Racecourse to start in a Race must:(a) ensure that such horse is fit and properly conditioned for the Race in which it isentered; and 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hesi Posted January 15, 2022 Author Share Posted January 15, 2022 I note also before the Wellington Guineas, Jamie Richards commenting that Shepherds Delight's run at Rotorua, was only really a trial. Perhaps the rule above, is to cover the horses welfare only, not the punter's welfare lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
curious Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 Follow them round, maybe run past a couple the last 100. Not alone but can't say I'm shy about doing that. Recently and spotted on here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mardigras Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 9 hours ago, curious said: Not so sure but it's never enforced to my knowledge. HORSE WELFARE [Amended 1 August 2017]650 (1) The Trainer or any other person in charge of a horse that is to be brought to theRacecourse or is at the Racecourse to start in a Race must:(a) ensure that such horse is fit and properly conditioned for the Race in which it isentered; and Clearly never enforced, and not worded strongly enough. If a trainer states a horse is there as a trial, that should be considered breaking the rules. 8 hours ago, Hesi said: I note also before the Wellington Guineas, Jamie Richards commenting that Shepherds Delight's run at Rotorua, was only really a trial. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hesi Posted January 15, 2022 Author Share Posted January 15, 2022 These blinkers must be wonderful things, that is what the form reversal is being attributed too As I said before, the black art of horse training, if you've got it, then the punting world is your oyster Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mardigras Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 (edited) 27 minutes ago, Hesi said: These blinkers must be wonderful things, that is what the form reversal is being attributed too As I said before, the black art of horse training, if you've got it, then the punting world is your oyster For sure - it was the Ear Covers Pre Race that allowed him to win the Wellington Cup. You've got to be on the lookout for these things Hesi. He hasn't been going that bad recently - I have his run on the 25th November being better than his cup win. And he can certainly put in as good a performance as yesterday without blinkers. Such as when winning over the same distance/track nearly 2 seconds faster, carrying 3kg more on a Good 3. It's whether you can assess the impact of a gear change pre race to any degree. If you can accurately, then the punting world would be your oyster. Edited January 15, 2022 by mardigras Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freda Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 1 hour ago, mardigras said: Clearly never enforced, and not worded strongly enough. If a trainer states a horse is there as a trial, that should be considered breaking the rules. I'm pretty sure Mandy Brown got pinged for doing just that, a few years ago. I know Colin W dined out on ' just a quiet run' for months. As for the rule 650 1[a] ...fit and properly conditioned....' to win? [ if it can ] or just to take part.? A world of difference. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hesi Posted January 15, 2022 Author Share Posted January 15, 2022 1 hour ago, Freda said: I'm pretty sure Mandy Brown got pinged for doing just that, a few years ago. I know Colin W dined out on ' just a quiet run' for months. As for the rule 650 1[a] ...fit and properly conditioned....' to win? [ if it can ] or just to take part.? A world of difference. I think that is what the rule is aiming at, that allows them to stop a horse racing that is clearly not up to it, eg tails the field by many lengths Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
curious Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 2 hours ago, Freda said: I'm pretty sure Mandy Brown got pinged for doing just that, a few years ago. I know Colin W dined out on ' just a quiet run' for months. As for the rule 650 1[a] ...fit and properly conditioned....' to win? [ if it can ] or just to take part.? A world of difference. Yes. It's acceptable here to run one as part of the conditioning process as long as they are fit enough to participate though "needing the run". Commonly done and often a furlong or two short of the horse's optimal distance. Punters have to figure that out. Where Mandy got in trouble from memory, the horse was fit enough and good enough to win but she wanted another conditioning run and didn't want to win. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hesi Posted January 26, 2022 Author Share Posted January 26, 2022 Waisake never accepted for the Wellington Cup??? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freda Posted January 26, 2022 Share Posted January 26, 2022 Broke down. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Addington Posted January 27, 2022 Share Posted January 27, 2022 Tendon Injury Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hesi Posted January 27, 2022 Author Share Posted January 27, 2022 No doubt that weight of money it was carrying last start 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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