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50% reduction in Standing Start Poll


karrotsishere

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On a side note, read 2 contrasting articles in past couple of days. 1 which quoted an Australian multi millionare owner whose star horse had won an NZ Cup & nearly 1 million dollars. And was having a big moan using word "retard" re Cup Handicap. 

Then yesterday saw a video, that brought tears to my eyes. Of a small time trainer, calling it quits as just cant afford to keep going.

An example of why stake money needed to go up. Too late for this trainer.

And also 1 of greed & entitlement. 

Its quite a contravisial topic & know the view is split, so will give latest update as Iv read. 

A decision is yet to be made. HRNZ were still in discussions, then would talk with board. Nothing is set in stone yet. (This was as of yesterday). 

If anything is to happen its unlikely this year (which I agree with). 

Announcement likely either way should be next week.

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6 minutes ago, Lightning Blue said:

Yes from me karrots . The men in office should definitely keep racing their horses. They strive to have the best conditions for harness racing while in power . Kevin Seymour in Brissie had high office at Albion for decades and think the place would of shut down without him. He races local heroes Colt Thirty One and last weeks Derby winner LEAP TO FAME . There's not really a conflict of interest IMO. they're very interested lol.

Regarding stands , definitely reduce them  for punters sake. My 9 mates or so at the local TAB,  ALL REFUSE to back Trots races at all anywhere, because of the threat of the horse they are supporting , Not even being in the race by galloping out the back. They back thoroughbred racing only sadly.

Ok cool, will put you down for status quo re people in office. 

So 1 a piece Karrots wants change.

Lightening against.

Ok folks will check back in tomorrow. Have a great day. Go Kiwis in Commonwealth Games. Such a shame triathlon guy got a 10 sec penalty! Arrgh. Could of been gold. 

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5 hours ago, karrotsishere said:

Methven miles stands, thought you maybe taking the piss. But then recall Mr Broster complaining about Methvan miles so figured maybe this was what he was talking about. 

That is my point. Why would a committee made up of horsemen and vested parties set a programme of standing starts over sprint distances if they were not wanted by fellow horsemen?

Here are some breakdowns of mobiles V stands in recent programmes. Mobile numbers first. 

If you want a 50% reduction in standing starts then you might as well make it 0% because if there is a need or want for stands you will not be meeting it.

7-4

5-3

4-4

5-3

7-3

8-2

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Thanks for those stats mobile v stand Happy interesting.

For change wins vote again by yet again a whisker 5-4. Same as handicap poll. The last poll re ownership & employment is a dead heat 1-1.

What I take from this is there is its harder to make change without a major majority. The votes are pretty much split down the middle. I find that interesting. In sense didnt realize the view was so even. On 3 different subjects too. Of course our polls were small. Much better to have received more votes to get more of an idea. 

Thanks to all those all polls for casting your vote. 

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19 hours ago, Happy Sunrise said:

That is my point. Why would a committee made up of horsemen and vested parties set a programme of standing starts over sprint distances if they were not wanted by fellow horsemen?

I think that short distance racing will eventually become the norm. It is much easier on the horse . They can race week in , week out like they do in Australia. Currently Sending them over distances mile and half plus is very draining on most horses. Some special ones can take it fine. but it's tough going.

But nowadays (at the faster mile rates they race at this century), they just sit and sprint in the distance races even. Often coming home too late unless you are Allstars.

Shorter distance racing (and the standing starts too sadly ) are Slightly Easier on the horse (as in Energy expended) , and they can back up the next week. So your Comment is Possibly the smart Nz Horsemen thinking of what's best for the horse and how much they can train / race it.

extreme example :  LANCELOT BROMAC a kiwi bred horse 'backed up' last Friday evening , racing every week nearly for over a decade in Brisbane now. 

Finishing 2nd yet again,  and another $1000 in the bank,  at race start number 466  !!   fricken incredible.

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On 7/30/2022 at 7:45 AM, karrotsishere said:

Ok folks will check back in tomorrow. Have a great day. Go Kiwis in Commonwealth Games. Such a shame triathlon guy got a 10 sec penalty! Arrgh. Could of been gold. 

The kiwi cyclists ( Ladies) won a heap of golds at the velodrome in Birmingham Karrots !! great stuff. sitting on their 2 wheels and whizzing around like the harness racing girls do, But only quicker !!  doing a great job beating up on the Poms and Aussies lol..

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On 7/30/2022 at 9:45 AM, karrotsishere said:
On 7/31/2022 at 10:37 AM, Lightning Blue said:

The kiwi cyclists ( Ladies) won a heap of golds at the velodrome in Birmingham Karrots !! great stuff. sitting on their 2 wheels and whizzing around like the harness racing girls do, But only quicker !!  doing a great job beating up on the Poms and Aussies lol..

 Go Kiwis in Commonwealth Games. Such a shame triathlon guy got a 10 sec penalty! Arrgh. Could of been gold. 

Wilde has put in a protest if successful will be Gold re thiathlon. Thought was weird at time. He handled himself so well. 

NZ 7s mens need to play their younger players & bench some of older (experienced) ones. Good people are calling it on Facebook. Olympics must have the faster younger better ones on against Fiji. Or will just lose again.

Why the coach benched 1 of the best players (young) in team, for Fiji match, when he was nom-ed for World 7s Dream Team by a variety of International Commentators. Stupid.  

No news re Harness, is it the calm before the storm ... ? Just joking. No news can be good sometimes. No drama.  

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2 hours ago, karrotsishere said:

Wilde has put in a protest if successful will be Gold re thiathlon. Thought was weird at time. He handled himself so well. 

NZ 7s mens need to play their younger players & bench some of older (experienced) ones.

Hey hope he has some luck !  and they share a gold !! seems pretty harsh to lose a chance at gold just for unclipping a helmet a few seconds too early ☹️

LOVED the rugby 7's . Aus , Fiji, and NZ mens and womens were all tough skillful matches last night. And then along came South Africa and WON the Men's !! lol..... 

Was cheering like mad for the Aussies girls , who took Gold in the end after rather surprisingly knocking off NZ in the semi-final.

I went to the GOLD COAST comm games final 4 years ago and Nz beat Oz in extra time there . It was tense stuff.

and just quickly , if you know, what was the result in harness there regarding the Nz Cup and Dominion handicaps ? Are they happening in November ? 

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I thought the incident with Hayden Wilde was interesting and a dilemma.

Had he not taken the penalty and run out the race, and say won, it would have been automatic DQ.

You will note that just before the area where he had to take his penalty, he raced ahead of Yee, who had headed him at that stage, as if to say, I have plenty left, enough to beat you, then he eased off, low fived Yee in a great gesture and ran into the area to take his 10 sec penalty.

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Yes by chance I just happened to watch last 10 mins of tri as was watching & waiting for NZ 7s boys to come on (Im friends with 2 VERY PROUD MUMS), re Wilde in news today said he didnt unclip was just touching clip.

Re Handicap, havent seen nor heard anything yet. Guerin posted on twitter Fri that nothing was set in stone, & HRNZ were still in talks & then going to board & deciding. And this week would decide & likely next year over this year IF & only IF it happened. But nothing is a given.

Also heard that they have received feedback INCLUDING 2 social media polls, INCLUDING this sites poll! So well done to all 9 for putting your vote in here. No doubt they would have taken in ALL feedback & discussed further, then decide.  

Ps maybe they saw your post Lightening elsewhere re this poll here & checked it out. 

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Heres update decision. Reading it as highly predicted no change this year to NZ Cup & Dominion, others not mentioned. The way I read it is open to change next year & they getting the people ready for change. Think right decision re leaving this year as too close to time to change. 

(Re this - The Free For All conditions will remain in 2022 and then we will look into whether the changes are needed in 2023 and beyond" says Woodham).

Harness Racing New Zealand has today confirmed that there won't be any changes to two of its biggest races this year.

"It's business as usual as far as we are concerned," says HRNZ Chief Executive Gary Woodham, "the New Zealand Cup and the Dominion Trot will take place at Addington during Cup week and they will be held under the same conditions as they have in recent years."

There's been a lot of discussion in recent days that some of New Zealand's premier staying races, including the New Zealand Cup, the Dominion, the Rowe Cup, and the Auckland Cup, would no longer be held under Free For All conditions, and become handicap races instead.

The TAB suspended its markets on both the New Zealand Cup and the Dominion as they waited for clarification from HRNZ as to whether the changes affected this year's events or not.

But Woodham is adamant that no such changes will happen.

"The Free For All conditions will remain in 2022 and then we will look into whether the changes are needed in 2023 and beyond" says Woodham.

An independent team of industry experts has been assessing the first six months of the new racing calendar and the handicapping issue is part of their review.

"One thing we need to know is what will be the horse population look like in the future," says Woodham, "do we have enough highly-rated horses to make our top races fair and competitive?"

"We have had handicap races in the past for the very same reasons we are looking at it now. If we have rating 75 to 120 horses in the same race we have to do something to make it a good contest. We are always looking at improving our wagering product."

The review is expected to be completed by October and any changes will have to be ratified by the HRNZ Board before they are implemented.

Edited by karrotsishere
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Here is more info - comments from D Williams & J Mckinnon. Again notice language re change in future. 

Addington Racing Industry Manager D Williams was pleased common sense had prevailed.

“It doesn’t mean there won’t be changes in the future - I’m sure there will be differing views - but HRNZ has a duty to consult,” he said in an earlier interview.

“It might be that we should have some handicaps but you can’t change the biggest race of the year when it’s so close.

Auckland Trotting Club president J Mackinnon said his club understood why the issue of horses being handicapped in Group races had arisen with the dominance of two horses this year in the open class ranks.

We can support the idea but require further clarification on the following.

https://www.lincolnfarms.co.nz/stories/hrnz-backtracks-on-big-race-handicaps-review-underway-but-status-quo-for-2022/

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1 hour ago, karrotsishere said:

"It's business as usual as far as we are concerned," says HRNZ Chief Executive Gary Woodham, "the New Zealand Cup and the Dominion Trot will take place at Addington during Cup week and they will be held under the same conditions as they have in recent years."

That is a big bus. 

1 hour ago, karrotsishere said:

An independent team of industry experts has been assessing the first six months of the new racing calendar and the handicapping issue is part of their review.

The review is expected to be completed by October and any changes will have to be ratified by the HRNZ Board before they are implemented.

So why on earth did HRNZ put the proposed changes out in the public before the end of the review and before the Board ratifies any of them?

Next, HRNZ will be giving cost of training payments to the All Stars.

 

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6 hours ago, Globederby19 said:

SSsshhh, don't let on to Neil. 🤣

Well it is all a bit of a shambles unfortunetly. Should of just said in proposal to clubs for next year & not included that bit about board vote 😬 

Plus dont forget the new calendar verse old season confusion.

Might seem like we have nothing better to do, but it is/was confusing, esp when still mixed messages presented on HRNZ website. 

In a recent HRNZ article it stated new calendar dates 1 Jan - 31 Dec in line with horses bdays. 

Then this week Auckland noms on HRNZ stated First meeting of season. Which has now been changed to First meeting of August. 

Then if you look at HRNZ Gore club article, it says incentive for Northern horses (great stuff) for new season meeting Aug.

& dont forget Cambridge just ended their season with Funny Face taking out Cambridge horse of the year. 

Edited by karrotsishere
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On 8/2/2022 at 5:15 PM, karrotsishere said:

e Then if you look at HRNZ Gore club article, it says incentive for Northern horses (great stuff) for new season meeting Aug.

Well done. It has now been changed & no longer reads as new season. Credit where credit is due to HRNZ & C McDonald. 

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On 8/1/2022 at 6:38 PM, karrotsishere said:

It's business as usual as far as we are concerned," says HRNZ Chief Executive Gary Woodham, "the New Zealand Cup and the Dominion Trot will take place at Addington during Cup week

I was just wondering the other day where the NZ Cup and Dominion were going to be run. 

Thanks for the confirmation Gary. 

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12 hours ago, Gospel Of Judas said:

Right so have got all figure out now!

Kind of. Read it is - TAB have their season  (1 Aug - 31 July).

HRNZ have a new racing calendar  (1 Jan - 31 Dec / Trainer&driver premiership count). 

Main 2 words are season & calendar.

Everything on HRNZ needs to align, send same message eg HRNZ racing calendar.

To have everything all the same, clubs should align with new HRNZ racing calendar. *they can do this by having now til 31 Dec 2022 a transit season (similar to HRNZ did last year). Then start a new count 1 Jan 2023 towards their horse / trainer of year etc. 

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