Rusty

It's the inconsistencies of it all that I can't fathom. 

Matthew Williamson, with the exact same offence, on the same day, 2 races earlier, gets a holiday for his efforts with the whip, yet doesn't start his vacation until AFTER the Show Day races this Friday. 

The stipes seem to have it in for him and Sarah O'Reilly. 

44 minutes ago, Happy Sunrise said:

A lot of words to say nothing indeed. Just to clarify they kind of do something in a roundabout way, but not really what they are supposed to do....

Thank you? Really, if you sent this request to me and had to reply like they have, I wouldn't be thanking you Rusty!

Haha dead right. 

Just a typical government department; not doing a helluva lot, but pretending too, and trying to justify their inflated wage. 

It took MPI the maximum allowable number of working days under the law, to pretty much say nothing: 

Thank you for your email of 16 September 2022 requesting information relating to the why the Ministry for Primary Industries (MPI), the Racing Integrity Board (RIB) and the Royal New Zealand Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Animals Incorporated (SPCA) have not met twice a year as per the Memorandum of Understanding (MOU), and your subsequent request for information relating to Jesse Alford. Your requests have been considered under the Official Information Act 1982 (OIA). 
 
I shall quote and respond to each part of your request below. 
 
You requested: Why didn't MPI fulfill their commitment to meet with the other 2 parties involved with the MOU (as outlined in the MOU, to meet in person, twice a year etc). To be fair, I'm asking the other two organisations the same question, not just MPI. 
 
The MOU provided to you in response to your OIA request (reference OIA22-0729) was signed on 10 November 2021.  
 
It relevantly states that: 
 
“The parties commit to … meet, preferably in person, twice a year. Senior representatives from all three organisations will be present at the meeting”. 
 
As advised in response to your OIA request (reference OIA22-0680) there have been meetings between the parties since the MOU was signed but none where all three parties were present.  
 
However, staff from all three organisations correspond regularly via email and phone to discuss individual situations (where appropriate) as well as opportunities for greater engagement between agencies.  
 
For example, on 26 July 2022, RIB officials presented their animal welfare programme to MPI Animal Welfare Inspectors. MPI Compliance staff also met with SPCA Inspectorate representatives on 27 July 2022 and 27 September 2022. MPI, the SPCA and RIB have also discussed joint animal welfare training opportunities for Animal Welfare Inspectors and RIB Investigators.  
 
We continue our commitment to animal welfare in the racing industry. 
 
You also requested: Under the OIA may I also please receive all information that MPI hold, including copies of photos and/or video footage, relating to the events, and investigation (that the RIB conducted, and shared with MPI), regarding horse trainer Jesse Alford (suspended from training for 7 years)? 
 
As recorded in the MOU, MPI and the RIB “may share information relating to the maintenance of the law and the investigation of offending under the Animal Welfare Act and Rules of Racing”. 
 
Any information supplied by the RIB to MPI regarding the RIB’s investigation into Jesse Alford was provided in this context. 
 
Further, the information was supplied to MPI subject to an obligation of confidence, the release of the requested information would be likely to prejudice the supply of similar information, and it is in the public interest that such information should continue to be supplied.  
 
Consequently, the information requested in the second part of your request has been withheld pursuant to the following sections of the OIA:  
 
•    Section 6(c) – the making available of that information would be likely to prejudice the maintenance of the law, including the prevention, investigation, and detection of offences, and the right to a fair trial; and  
•    Section 9(2)(ba)(i) – to protect information which is subject to an obligation of confidence, where the making available of the information would be likely to prejudice the supply of similar information and it is in the public interest that such information should continue to be supplied. 
 
MPI is satisfied that in the circumstances of this case, the withholding of the information is not outweighed by other considerations which render it desirable in the public interest to make the information available.  
 
I trust the information provided is of assistance. Should you have any concerns with this response, I would encourage you to raise these with the Ministry for Primary Industries at 
Official.InformationAct@mpi.govt.nz. Alternatively, you are advised of your right to also raise any concerns with the Office of the Ombudsman. Contact details are: Office of the Ombudsman, PO Box 10152, Wellington 6143 or at info@ombudsman.parliament.nz.  
 
Ngā mihi nui 
 

4 hours ago, karrotsishere said:

Just 1 Rusty. I heard 2 super amazing trainers Deep South.  

They are all amazing down south lol but I won't go into anything further than that on here. Not at the moment anyway. 

Other than to say, my favourite southern trainer is old man Williamson. One of the all time good guys, and a very fine horseman indeed. 

8 hours ago, karrotsishere said:

Woodlands Watch not anymore, hear its more like the Deep South watch nowadays.

I think it is (or you may say "was") "Woodend Watch", and not to be confused with the good folk at Woodlands lol

But yes, your point is received loud and clear, and isn't that UDR ultra impressive for that trainer?!

Head and shoulders above the Purdon's, Dunn's, the Telfer's, old man Williamson, Nairn, Herlihy etc, etc quite remarkable indeed, I can't recall a UDR above 0.5 before. 

2 hours ago, Happy Sunrise said:

You are on fire, Rusty.

Well done.

Haha sorry, just needed to get all that sh!t off my chest.

I'm feeling better now, having had a cup of tea (same one that the monkeys drink), and a lie down. 

On 10/2/2022 at 1:13 PM, Happy Sunrise said:

I can see why harness racing is not an attractive proposition for gamblers anymore.

Far from ideal. That photo sums it up really, and one could understand why some punters would be discouraged from wagering on the trots. 

There are probably a few variables as to why this happens, but if the mobile was to have a lower maximum speed at the point of release, would that help things? 

Just now, Rusty said:

2021  Harness racing horse injected with banned substance     Investigation conducted by RIU – Trainer disqualified for 7 years. 
MPI reviewed RIU investigation. Evidence gathered by RIU inadmissible so not progressed further under the Animal Welfare Act. 

"Evidence gathered by RIU inadmissible so not progressed further under the Animal Welfare Act" 

Interesting.

Disappointing. 

Not surprising. 

Typical. 

Useless. 

And that's why I have asked MPI for all the info they have on the Jesse Alford case. 

And those 4 cases were: 
  
2021  Harness racing horse injected with banned substance     Investigation conducted by RIU – Trainer disqualified for 7 years. 
MPI reviewed RIU investigation. Evidence gathered by RIU inadmissible so not progressed further under the Animal Welfare Act. 
  
2021     Trainer seen with syringe near horse     Investigation conducted by RIB under the Rules of Racing – Trainer disqualified for 21 months. 
MPI advised of investigation as per MOU. 
MPI reviewed RIU investigation. 
Testing unable to confirm what substance horse was injected with, therefore no evidence to prove animal harm. 
  
2022  Thoroughbred horse tested 
positive for 
Methamphetamine     Investigation conducted by RIU – Trainer disqualified for 18 months. 
MPI advised of investigation as per MOU. 
Positive result due to contamination / exposure in environment. No evidence of animal harm. 
 
2022 Thoroughbred horse returned 
positive test for methamphetamine     Investigation conducted by RIU – no outcome to date. MPI advised of investigation as per MOU and undertook additional inquiries regarding testing. No 
evidence that positive result was due to administration of drugs. No evidence of animal harm. 
 
 

I also asked MPI: 

How many horse racing stables MPI have visited (in the last 12 months), to investigate the use of prohibited substances, or performance enhancing substances, on race horses. 

Their response: 

"In regard to your request for information on MPI visits to horse racing stables in the last 12 months, we have searched our records from 1 January 2021 to 19 August 2022 and found four cases relating to the use of prohibited or performance enhancing substances. As per the MOU, these cases were investigated by the RIU, and MPI did not visit the stables." 
 

On 16 September I raised a further OIA with MPI: 

11 minutes ago, Rusty said:

I also raised an OIA request over this exact issue too. 

I will try and post about it, on this thread soon, as I finally received a response from MPI. 

Here's my question to MPI: 

And just to be be very clear on this, I am not part of the anti-racing brigade, and not part of the cult that are out to try and shut down racing.

Just wanting MPI (a government department of Jacindastan), to hold the bastards that mistreat horses accountable for their actions. 

13 minutes ago, Happy Sunrise said:

Reading over the Memorandum of Understanding, one could come to the fair assumption the 3 parties are derelict in their duty.

I've asked MPI why they have elected not to meet the other two parties at the same time, and why they initially agreed to meet twice a year, but nope, they can't be arsed. 

15 minutes ago, Happy Sunrise said:

You would think they would be discussing the deaths of the 3 Telfer horses

I also raised an OIA request over this exact issue too. 

I will try and post about it, on this thread soon, as I finally received a response from MPI. 

I raised a OIA request with MPI recently, as I was keen to find out what's happened since the introduction of the MOU. 

Farkn nothing is the answer, as seen below, with this response from MPI: 

"The Ministry for Primary Industries (MPI), the Racing Integrity Board (RIB) which has been in place since 1 July 2021 (replacing the Racing Integrity Unit (RIU)) and the Royal New Zealand Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Animals Incorporated (SPCA) work closely to help ensure animal welfare standards are met for those involved in racing. A Memorandum of Understanding (MOU) between the parties clarifies who investigates incidents involving racing animals. Under this MOU, the RIU investigates all race day and non-race day incidents under the Rules of Racing and notifies MPI and or the SPCA who may also investigate the incident under the Animal Welfare Act 1999 (AWA).

There have been meetings between those parties since 2021 but none where all three parties were present, and none where minutes were recorded."

It's all b/s. They say they work closely, but have never even been in the same room together. 

What makes it even worse is that this directly contravenes the MOU that they all signed up for, under the heading 3.1 Commitments, where they are meant to have met twice a year. 

Garry Orr from MPI, hang your head in shame. 

Bloody glad I held on to all of my stuff too, and didn't give it away to the buggers. The spiders will get some use outta it. 

4 hours ago, Happy Sunrise said:

Is there anywhere one can see the photo?

I was oncourse tonight Happy, and noone that I asked knew where the photo could be viewed. 

The admin office was vacant, and the team member from Addington at the service desk, had no clue what the hell I was on about. To make it worse, she pulled the Jacinda trick of smiling, when delivering bad news. I asked if she could point me in the right direction, or asking someone else to assist. Nope. She could not give any less of a ****. 

Funny that, because last year, I asked the lady if there would be someone at the club that would be interested in taking a look at some harness racing memorabilia that I have in storage. Hundred year old racebooks, photos, trophies and the like. They couldn't have bent over backwards for me fast enough, as I suggested that they they may like to have it, and put some of it on display etc. Great customer service that time, but not so tonight unfortunately.

I tried for ya mate. I tried. 

2 hours ago, karrotsishere said:

Just 1 thing ..... Guessing, it was gallops folks who did it ... ? otherwise why have a gallop picture to advertise Harness NZ Cup & Show week? Lets hope it was gallops, then it gets a 10/10 from me.

If it was Harness well done. Great stuff. But why the gallops pic ??? & if it wasnt Harness then where is your NZ Cup, Show Week advertising? & why is Gallops doing it & not you?

It's an advert for "Cup and Show week", and not merely the NZ Trotting Cup. It's a collaborated effort between the three racing codes, plus the A&P Show outfit (they have a new name now, but old school, we all know it as the A&P Show). 

The whole week goes off its chops in C town. The Friday (Show Day) is a public holiday (Canterbury Anniversary day), but half the town unofficially closes down on Tuesday afternoon for the Addington races. 

Cup day at Addington is obviously the main highlight of Cup week for most, but Riccarton's Cup day on the Saturday is becoming more and more popular every year, and whilst it probably won't catch Addington's big dance anytime soon, it is certainly catching up in the popularity stakes, if crowd numbers are anything to go by. 

25 minutes ago, Lightning Blue said:

 

Hi Globe, I'm a great supporter of Nz Cup . Horses like Lightning Blue can turn up and give a great contest. 

Even the very first Cup run that you mentioned in 1904 the second placegetter NORICE was an American import , bought in to try and win the great race. horses like Steel Jaw, Gammalite , Smoken Up , Carrabean Blaster, For a Reason, Tiger Tara, Arden Rooney, Sushi sushi, Lightning Blue have all turned up to have a crack from Oz. with fairly good results too, but I do enjoy a 'Local' trained horse taking out the feature. 

Is nobody in Nz prepared to 'buy in' overseas horses anymore at all ? There must be some rich bloke there ? Even Seymour in Brisbane (a multi millionaire) imported Mr FEELGOOD (now a stallion at stud) and won the Interdominion defeating Blacks A Fake on home turf no less, withan NZ Trainer too !!! tim Butt I think... 

You need some IMPORTS there as well as EXPORTS to balance things up a bit !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 

 

Always a welcome addition, any Aussie runners in the Cup. I wish more competed in the great race. 

Perhaps the "standing" start puts the Aussies off a bit maybe? 

It's a bit of coin in airfares etc to go all that way, with no guarantee that the start is going to be clean. And let's face it, the start of the Cup is more often a shambles than not. 

5 hours ago, karrotsishere said:

The NZ Cup in the South Island has the name, so prob people will know about it. Name recognition. But done right & well The Race could easily surpass it 

Big call that, but it'll be interesting.

As a social event, I don't think NZ Cup day will be surpassed by The Race anytime soon. A decent chunk of the Cup day crowd don't give a rat's about the horses. They go there to see, and be seen. Pull duck faces, (try and pull the opposite sex whilst at it), and stick it on the 'gram, tick tock, and update their Bookfaces lol 

Cup day is ingrained into the Canterbury psyche, so I can't see the crowds steering clear unless the laws of Jacindastan are imposed once again. 

But strictly from a horse race perspective, The Race is going to be the premier race for the harness code within 4 years I'm picking.

Better horses (than the Cup) + better stake money (than the Cup) = premier race. 

35 minutes ago, karrotsishere said:

The Race is harder to gain a start in = more prestigious over time. 

I dunno about that. 

The Everest and the All Star Mile are hard to get in to, but it would take a lot for those races to become more prestigious than a slipper, a Cox Plate, or a Melbourne Cup, just in my opinion. 

The other thing too, with the slot races, a horse could win it, but there is usually no knowing how much of the winning stake the owner(s) actually get of it, depending upon the contractual arrangements agreed upon prior to the race etc.

So may not be as prestigious as other races.

29 minutes ago, karrotsishere said:

Yea know that, was just word I used. 

See Rusty, some have called us "we are dreamers", as we think The Race, will by pass NZ Cup. 

Im just driving home just part of our point. 

The Race is harder to gain a start in = more prestigious over time. 

Sorry, I misunderstood. 

In terms of chances, of Heza Sport getting a crack; yeah look he wouldn't be in my first half dozen picks, but there is no reason why he couldn't be picked up, if he was to take the step up in the open class grade. Looks like a really nice horse, that could go on with it. Time will tell. 

I'm stoked for CJ and Julie DeFilippi too. They deserve to have another top liner, so I'm hoping for Heza Sport to have every success in the future. 

1 hour ago, karrotsishere said:

As of today what odds do you give Heza Sport to qualify for The Race?

Horses can't "qualify" for The Race, they are picked up by the slot holders. 

So I guess it comes down to negotiations between slot holders and connections of horses. 

9 minutes ago, Happy Sunrise said:

Surely Gary Woodham can ask his own questions 😁

I told you Gazza!!

I told you that we'd get caught out!

There are a few switched on in this forum! 

Ask your own bloody questions next time. 

P.S start digging out your mum's old Christmas recipes. That ham one from last year kind of missed the mark.