mardigras Posted February 18, 2020 Share Posted February 18, 2020 I've just watched the submissions put up by Curious elsewhere. Bloody interesting. And one of the areas I see where there is the split. There is the difference between those clubs that are subsidised compared to those that are doing the subsidising. Yet the politicians clearly haven't understood that (until perhaps now if they've understood the submissions). Something so damn obvious. Let alone the land grab aspect. And seeing my old mate Whiteman. That was a crackup. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mardigras Posted February 18, 2020 Author Share Posted February 18, 2020 Also, the sale of urban land around the major clubs in Australia - has not been to the benefit of RV or other code bodies etc - it has been to the benefit of the club itself. The issue they are all missing when they compare Australia to NZ when they talk about the wagering platform, is that in Australia they haven't suggested they should fund the industry well beyond what that wagering platform provides. In NZ, they all want huge stakes increases even though the wagering does not align with that. Comparing it to Australia is folly, since the wagering platform and the stakes model aligns there. We only have an issue because we want to provide stakes beyond the level of interest in betting on NZ racing. No doubt driven by what happens in Australia and the costs of rearing/training a horse to race. If we provided stakes of $10k maidens and Group ones at $100k, we might align a lot better. But no one wants to hear that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mardigras Posted February 18, 2020 Author Share Posted February 18, 2020 And great point about attracting punters. However, I don't see that changing with less tracks, if the money isn't spent on those track surfaces. Having more racing at Trentham, Awapuni, Te Rapa and Ellerslie will not deliver that attraction. They will still be crap with no confidence to many larger punters - the same issue they face now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hesi Posted February 18, 2020 Share Posted February 18, 2020 7 minutes ago, mardigras said: Also, the sale of urban land around the major clubs in Australia - has not been to the benefit of RV or other code bodies etc - it has been to the benefit of the club itself. The issue they are all missing when they compare Australia to NZ when they talk about the wagering platform, is that in Australia they haven't suggested they should fund the industry well beyond what that wagering platform provides. In NZ, they all want huge stakes increases even though the wagering does not align with that. Comparing it to Australia is folly, since the wagering platform and the stakes model aligns there. We only have an issue because we want to provide stakes beyond the level of interest in betting on NZ racing. No doubt driven by what happens in Australia and the costs of rearing/training a horse to race. If we provided stakes of $10k maidens and Group ones at $100k, we might align a lot better. But no one wants to hear that. Just off the top of your head, the current funding of Thoroughbred is about $80 mil, if it was a self funding model, what would the figure be? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mardigras Posted February 18, 2020 Author Share Posted February 18, 2020 The other issue with the submissions is that you get people that are commenting on things they know very little about. Suggesting that V'Landys has helped things in NSW is ill founded. There is a balancing act that needs to be undertaken in order to achieve the best for the industry as a whole whilst maintaining the levels of income a code body requires to create aspiration and incentive (and stakes). All V'Landys has done is taken the 'increase the cost to the punter option' . People that continually praise him should perhaps ask themselves one simple question. Why has he had to continually seek to change things such as race field fees, POC taxes, levy rates from the government - if all of his measures have been so great? The reason he has to do that, is because his measures directly impact the sustainability of what he is trying to achieve. And when he's gone, it'll be too late to realise the error of his ways. It's the same here. Taxing the punter more and more does not deliver more and more in the long term. It's a short term strategy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mardigras Posted February 18, 2020 Author Share Posted February 18, 2020 4 minutes ago, Hesi said: Just off the top of your head, the current funding of Thoroughbred is about $80 mil, if it was a self funding model, what would the figure be? Self funding as in what? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hesi Posted February 18, 2020 Share Posted February 18, 2020 The money generated off wagering on thoroughbreds Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mardigras Posted February 18, 2020 Author Share Posted February 18, 2020 1 minute ago, Hesi said: The money generated off wagering on thoroughbreds My opinion is that under the cost model of NZRB, NZ thoroughbred racing generates zero or close to it in net revenues (net betting revenue less costs associated with generating that net betting revenue). If it is positive, it wouldn't be by much. The $80m is coming from off-shore racing, sport and pokies in the main. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hesi Posted February 18, 2020 Share Posted February 18, 2020 That is scandalous, even if you were only say half right. The tail has wagged the dog into a state of exhaustion bordering on collapse Thank God for the Racing Act, but for how long 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mardigras Posted February 19, 2020 Author Share Posted February 19, 2020 NZRB sold NZ racing down the river - and in all the excitement, the likes of NZTR couldn't wait to get a spot on the raft. You wouldn't want either bunch having a say in your own business. And now we are where we are, and the road back is nigh impossible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hesi Posted February 19, 2020 Share Posted February 19, 2020 34 minutes ago, mardigras said: NZRB sold NZ racing down the river - and in all the excitement, the likes of NZTR couldn't wait to get a spot on the raft. You wouldn't want either bunch having a say in your own business. And now we are where we are, and the road back is nigh impossible. Barbarians are at the gate, figuratively speaking, which means it is time for revolutionary not evolutionary change. Just imagine if NZ Racing was a public company, even a private one. Firstly it would never have been allowed to reach this state, secondly, there would be major restructuring, whereas all we see is tinkering at snail pace Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mardigras Posted February 19, 2020 Author Share Posted February 19, 2020 (edited) 6 minutes ago, Hesi said: Barbarians are at the gate, figuratively speaking, which means it is time for revolutionary not evolutionary change. Just imagine if NZ Racing was a public company, even a private one. Firstly it would never have been allowed to reach this state, secondly, there would be major restructuring, whereas all we see is tinkering at snail pace A public company would have been put into some form of liquidation to sell off assets to pay creditors. There would be no consideration to trading out of the situation. Edited February 19, 2020 by mardigras Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buller Rep Posted February 19, 2020 Share Posted February 19, 2020 No board of directors would have let a CEO and his advisers spend $40 million + ongoing annualised costs of $18 million on something that they know nothing about, especially if they didn’t have it in the first place and that was exactly the situation about two years ago. No wonder we are in such a mess. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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