NZTR Directions paper

[curious]

NZTR Directions Paper - FINAL VERSION.pdf

[mardigras]

Twilight racing/night racing - NZ racing saviours.

The trend continues however - focusing on driving revenue from offshore punters, not enough about the domestic punter. I may have missed it, but what are they going to do to claw back the punters that have shifted the majority of their betting elsewhere away from NZ racing?

[Hesi]

Thanks for that Curious

I started reading it, and thought it was just a status summary, but then came to the new initiatives part, which I thought had some very good innovative new ideas.

The crux of the matter, will the new initiatives stop the drain of promising horses being exported, and top horses being raced in Aus, thereby making most of our racing, no better than Aus country level

I see the Levin Classic moved again, this time to March.

I give it all a tick, for trying to address one of the problems, quality of racing here

[mardigras]

5 minutes ago, Hesi said:

I give it all a tick, for trying to address one of the problems, quality of racing here

What part of it made you feel that quality of racing would improve?

[Hesi]

The new initiatives, such as Aotearoa Champions Day, where all races would be 200K

That is getting up there with a par of Aus Metro.

The proviso I put in, was will that attract good horses, as to be honest that Livamol Classic was rubbish

[mardigras]

2 minutes ago, Hesi said:

The new initiatives, such as Aotearoa Champions Day, where all races would be 200K

That is getting up there with a par of Aus Metro.

The proviso I put in, was will that attract good horses, as to be honest that Livamol Classic was rubbish

My opinion is that high end stakes doesn't improve racing quality, low end stakes does. It takes time to get to a high level, and if you race for little more than a months fees to win a race, you won't retain the horses for the time when the stakes are higher.

Aus metro races for high stakes at low level/rating races. And provincial also races for decent stakes at low levels, similar to high rating races.

And quality racing requires trust in the surface from the spectators (and borne out by the racing). It's not quality if horses aren't afforded a chance if the track denies that.

Would the all blacks be any good if the grass roots rugby was shit and everyone aspired to be an all black - and had to play years of shit rugby to get there?

[mardigras]

And if you look at the current Cox Plate market, our top horse is currently at $13s for a place in a 9 horse field, after being odds on in Group 1 recently.

He might do better than that, but that's where they see the 'quality'

[Hesi]

There were other initiatives attempting to address the next levels down, such as Champion Stayers series and Country Cup Series.

The lower end stakes need to be addressed, I recall Ellerslie are 50K minimum now, but I presume you are meaning maidens and the next couple of classes up

There seemed top be a number of initiatives addressing track quality, not enough though, only so much money until they get their hands on Avondale lol

 

[Hesi]

6 minutes ago, mardigras said:

And if you look at the current Cox Plate market, our top horse is currently at $13s for a place in a 9 horse field, after being odds on in Group 1 recently.

He might do better than that, but that's where they see the 'quality'

Exactly, rubbish.  Be surprised if Callsign Mav does not finish last

[mardigras]

2 minutes ago, Hesi said:

There were other initiatives attempting to address the next levels down, such as Champion Stayers series and Country Cup Series.

The lower end stakes need to be addressed,

 

They do need to be addressed. But by track consolidation, how does that make those regions feel inclusive of racing? The myriad of tracks is not the problem, it's the desire to strangle those clubs with having to run races for no stakes, giving prestige club, all the money. Quite simply, they're fuckwits.

[Hesi]

Yes that is an issue, especially when the races that prestige clubs hold don't come close to paying their way

Pass

[mardigras]

They've been fed some bullshit from a guy that doesn't understand grassroots racing.

Look at the number of clubs/tracks in Queensland. Same population as NZ, heaps of clubs. We're in the process of losing grass roots interest in racing.

 

Edited October 22, 2021 by mardigras

[Freda]

Having a 'country cup'  series would be dependent upon having country clubs/tracks,  surely?

 

[Hesi]

13 hours ago, mardigras said:

They've been fed some bullshit from a guy that doesn't understand grassroots racing.

Look at the number of clubs/tracks in Queensland. Same population as NZ, heaps of clubs. We're in the process of losing grass roots interest in racing.

 

You could post maps like that for all of the Aus states.  It represents how strong racing is in Australia.  It is not strong in NZ and is in retrenchment mode and has been for a long time.  Lots of small feeder clubs, seem fundamental to any sport/racing, but we just seem to have lost it in NZ

[mardigras]

12 minutes ago, Hesi said:

You could post maps like that for all of the Aus states.  It represents how strong racing is in Australia.  It is not strong in NZ and is in retrenchment mode and has been for a long time.  Lots of small feeder clubs, seem fundamental to any sport/racing, but we just seem to have lost it in NZ

Racing is not strong here due to the actions of management, pushing everything except NZ racing under some misguided view that the revenues available through offshore racing will ensure local racing success. 

There is more interest in racing among NZ people now (money wise), than there was 15 years ago. Sadly, management have pushed that interest away from local racing.

[Hesi]

Catch 22

The only thing keeping NZ racing afloat, is the revenue off offshore racing and sports, which is protected by the Racing Act

If you were in charge of the NZRB or whatever it is called now, why would you not focus on that, to meet your own projections, instead of the problem child that is NZ racing.  You have to, because of the Racing Act, but I bet you wouldn't like it

[mardigras]

4 minutes ago, Hesi said:

Catch 22

The only thing keeping NZ racing afloat, is the revenue off offshore racing and sports, which is protected by the Racing Act

If you were in charge of the NZRB or whatever it is called now, why would you not focus on that, to meet your own projections, instead of the problem child that is NZ racing.  You have to, because of the Racing Act, but I bet you wouldn't like it

Not a catch 22 at all. Designed by management. They changed the playing field, and now they're stuck with it. The decisions made caused this. Before the decisions, there was no problem (and actually, more revenue when you factor in the levy rates etc between now and 15 years ago). 

They took decisions believing something that was not correct. That failed. Here we are. When it started failing, they pushed harder in the same direction. Increasing the failure rate. Too big an ego to admit their mistake. So compounded it by beating their chests and claiming how good everything was going. 

[mardigras]

7 minutes ago, Hesi said:

If you were in charge of the NZRB or whatever it is called now, why would you not focus on that, to meet your own projections, instead of the problem child that is NZ racing.  You have to, because of the Racing Act, but I bet you wouldn't like it

If I was in charge, I would remove commingling. I would restrict the number of offshore events to around 30 - 40 per week. I would reduce the takeout rates on tote in an attempt to entice people back to the tote. And I would introduce minimum bet levels for customers on fixed odds. Along with promoting NZ racing nearly 100%.

That would lose heaps of customers to offshore providers. But I have to start somewhere, and you know what they say about doing the same thing and expecting a different result.

[Turny]

Left field idea, but what about marketing the product to the future audience, the 20 to 40 aged group.

But with no TV, radio, print media or advertising one assumes the marketing division closed down a few years ago.

On the road to nowhere .....

[Hesi]

Not left field Tom, they should have started doing it 20-30 years ago, and something i have always said is the number one reason racing has declined in NZ.

Be wary to differentiate between marketing wagering, which the TAB do, which indirectly promotes racing, and marketing racing, which is the domain of NZTR, which as you say there is no budget for

[mardigras]

18 minutes ago, Turny said:

Left field idea, but what about marketing the product to the future audience, the 20 to 40 aged group.

But with no TV, radio, print media or advertising one assumes the marketing division closed down a few years ago.

On the road to nowhere .....

You need to look across the board so I agree with targeting all audiences. 

Edited October 22, 2021 by mardigras

[Turny]

Agree Hesi,

I rarely go on course these days (except at Randwick or Flemington) but starting races at 11.30 and finishing at 5.00pm just won't attract young folk. That timetable is from the 50s.

Start at 2pm last race 6pm, dinner on course and a band and dance away till 2 in the morning, that's what they want.

Just so simple

 

[Turny]

6 races, start at 2pm

$75 entry for buffet dinner, free glass of wine with dinner, free dancing till 2am and 2 free $10 Bets to be spent on races 1 to 4 so they get used to punting.

Better than scanning Tinder to meet someone.

So simple

[Hesi]

Good thoughts Tom, but people are not going to fall out of the sky, you have to tell them about it, every month, every year, so you catch the new generations.  This is the most fundamental business practice there is when it comes to building a business.  The only thing that has changed, is the way you do it, with the advent of the internet and social media.  The whole way of communicating and selling your product has changed, and it has become the domain of the mainly younger people

[curious]

Still working my way through this but one thing that struck me today was this question:

Do you support NZTR funding the creation of new, higher prizemoney events, to drive
significantly improved wagering and customer engagement outcomes?

But there is no case or evidence for " higher prizemoney events" driving "significantly improved wagering".  The evidence is clear that these events do NOT drive wagering sufficiently to cover the costs of additional prizemoney and I am unclear from the document where they get that idea.