Ashburton Monday

[karrotsishere]

20 minutes ago, Happy Sunrise said:

(is the Jewels still going?)

Next week they will announce the dates for ALL the major races thru to Dec 2022. That will include Jewels & its location there was talk it could be at Cambridge again. So we will see. Look forward to seeing the announcement. 

[Double R]

3 minutes ago, Addington said:

The problem with that option  and it has been studied before by officials is that it wont make any difference to the quality of the fields on Cup week. So its not going to provide any more income to the club via increased turnover.

Thanks for that information Addy.

In that case, why have the cup at $600,000, and having had a horse in that race in the three years, would think the same horses would run if it was $100,000, because it is the ultimate race for any owner to win, and consider the same betting would be invested on the race.

[Happy Sunrise]

9 minutes ago, Addington said:

The problem with that option  and it has been studied before by officials is that it wont make any difference to the quality of the fields on Cup week. So its not going to provide any more income to the club via increased turnover.

True but it is quite a narrow view isn't it. I bet those drunk young ones and fashionistas who flock to Cup Day would be shocked to think the 'big day' they are attending only has 25 000 dollar stakes. They probably think it is like a big Aussie race day with its 100 000s +

Also means the hype around Cup Day is just around a couple of  big races as 25 000 is not much for the others. Club is using the traditional of Cup Day to pull one over the owners?

[Double R]

3 minutes ago, Happy Sunrise said:

True but it is quite a narrow view isn't it. I bet those drunk young ones and fashionistas who flock to Cup Day would be shocked to think the 'big day' they are attending only has 25 000 dollar stakes. They probably think it is like a big Aussie race day with its 100 000s +

Also means the hype around Cup Day is just around a couple of  big races as 25 000 is not much for the others. Club is using the traditional of Cup Day to pull one over the owners?

I think Cup week has changed, and having maiden races on your biggest day shows how the depth of the number of horses around is very low.

[Happy Sunrise]

4 minutes ago, Double R said:

I think Cup week has changed, and having maiden races on your biggest day shows how the depth of the number of horses around is very low.

I think there is something inherently wrong with this programming. Newcomers to the track get a stake of 25 000 and a Group 3 FFA has a stake of 35 000.

A 10 000 difference. That is pathetic.

Sell....sell....sell.....sell.....sell.....

 

[karrotsishere]

Iv never ever looked at the stake money on offer for NZ CUP Week. Simply I guess as it has never been relevant to me. However will take a look at it now as it has been brought up here. (Don't even know how much NZ CUP is worth lol).

Great point there Happy re maiden tentative at $25k while G3 FFA only $10k higher at $35k

The only 1 stake that I know for sure well actually more a case of I THNK IS Miracle Mile in Aussie which is 1 million. And think that is because its the only 1 million dollar race Down Under for Harness. And think it maybe invite only or something. And limited runners. 

Edited October 23, 2021 by karrotsishere

[karrotsishere]

28 minutes ago, Double R said:

I think Cup week has changed, and having maiden races on your biggest day shows how the depth of the number of horses around is very low.

Good point. So not just a problem in the North then. Peeps love to point out how the North has problems you see. Well the did on the other site. 

[Double R]

21 minutes ago, karrotsishere said:

Iv never ever looked at the stake money on offer for NZ CUP Week. Simply I guess as it has never been relevant to me. However will take a look at it now as it has been brought up here. (Don't even know how much NZ CUP is worth lol).

Great point there Happy re maiden tentative at $25k while G3 FFA only $10k higher at $35k

The only 1 stake that I know for sure well actually more a case of I THNK IS Miracle Mile in Aussie which is 1 million. And think that is because its the only 1 million dollar race Down Under for Harness. And think it maybe invite only or something. And limited runners. 

It is great having you on here Karrots, and know members will be able to share many things with you, as you launch into your venture into horse ownership, and your thirst to learn.

[karrotsishere]

1 hour ago, Double R said:

It is great having you on here Karrots, and know members will be able to share many things with you, as you launch into your venture into horse ownership, and your thirst to learn.

Thank you kind sir for the compliment 😄

[Double R]

25 minutes ago, karrotsishere said:

Thank you kind sir for the compliment 😄

And you will see most on here are genuine, and will thrilled if you get a good result, and will not scorn if you don't get the result they hoped for.

[Royal Nod]

3 hours ago, Happy Sunrise said:

I think there is something inherently wrong with this programming. Newcomers to the track get a stake of 25 000 and a Group 3 FFA has a stake of 35 000.

A 10 000 difference. That is pathetic.

Sell....sell....sell.....sell.....sell.....

 

Agree. The junior Ffa should be 50k.  They could take 10k from the non win race,it would still be a good maiden stake at 15k.  I’m sure the Met could make up the difference of 5k

[Happy Sunrise]

2 hours ago, Royal Nod said:

Agree. The junior Ffa should be 50k.  They could take 10k from the non win race,it would still be a good maiden stake at 15k.  I’m sure the Met could make up the difference of 5k

Addington charges $100 each to enter the futurity so that is how they get to 30K. If maidens are getting 25K straight up, maybe they should pay too.

I am not sure of the breakdown of stakes but it could see a maiden get more stake money than a horse who finishes third in a Group race. Work that out.

6 hours ago, Double R said:

I think Cup week has changed, and having maiden races on your biggest day shows how the depth of the number of horses around is very low.

Surely there are enough horses to not have maidens on Cup Day?

Edited October 24, 2021 by Happy Sunrise

[Double R]

95% of owners have horses that don't pay their way, and as an enthusiast, ownership is my use of my discretionary monies.

I have always thought that the first win should have a stake to acknowledge the contribution that has been put into supplying the product for gambling, in order for the sport to survive. If all maiden races were $30,000, and the winner got $25,000, then while it will not have covered  what it may have cost to get the horse to the races, it would be a substantial reward for all the effort that has gone in.

Of course, it necessary to reward excellence and high quality, and it costs just as much to keep a good one in training, than it does for a not so good one, so why not lowered the stakes for the bigger races, and balance the stakes across the board. If the connections of of the top tier horses don't like it, then they can send their horses overseas, and reverse the trend that is happening now, with the lesser horse being sold or raced overseas, and is depleting our numbers at the basic level that is needed for every day/night racing.

[karrotsishere]

59 minutes ago, Royal Nod said:

Agree. The junior Ffa should be 50k.  They could take 10k from the non win race,it would still be a good maiden stake at 15k.  I’m sure the Met could make up the difference of 5k

Agree after looking at this I was thinking something like from $25k maiden - $35k FFA to say as take away from maiden e.g. $5k so becomes $20k and add to FFA Group 3 so $40k.

20k for a maiden and $40k for Group 3.

[Addington]

5 hours ago, Happy Sunrise said:

I think there is something inherently wrong with this programming. Newcomers to the track get a stake of 25 000 and a Group 3 FFA has a stake of 35 000.

A 10 000 difference. That is pathetic.

Sell....sell....sell.....sell.....sell.....

 

Agree with you 100%. What surprises me  is why more NZ owners dont retain ownership  when they send their horses offshore. Spellbound is a classic example of what i'm on about.

[Double R]

12 minutes ago, Addington said:

Agree with you 100%. What surprises me  is why more NZ owners dont retain ownership  when they send their horses offshore. Spellbound is a classic example of what i'm on about.

Hi Addy,

I have asked many owners that very question about retaining ownership, and they have said, they want to see them run in the flesh. For many of us, it is not about the stake money, it is our passion, and an interest in our lives.

Cheers.

Robert.

[Happy Sunrise]

38 minutes ago, Addington said:

What surprises me  is why more NZ owners dont retain ownership  when they send their horses offshore

When the stakes went up at Auckland I thought more horses might have gone up there but it doesn't seem to have happened. I would also initial costs and lack of knowledge about racing in Oz would play a large part too.

I might be very wrong, but I think trainers prefer to keep the horse in their hands as they get their weekly training fee which is their bread and butter income. Not sure.

[karrotsishere]

46 minutes ago, Addington said:

Agree with you 100%. What surprises me  is why more NZ owners dont retain ownership  when they send their horses offshore. Spellbound is a classic example of what i'm on about.

That is what plan to do with Sweetie. Maybe for a season. Make the money in Oz racing then bring her back.

26 minutes ago, Double R said:

I have asked many owners that very question about retaining ownership, and they have said, they want to see them run in the flesh. For many of us, it is not about the stake money, it is our passion, and an interest in our lives.

You are losing me here a lil bit Double R, hang on you were saying to increase maiden stakes to 30k. And now you are saying its not about the money.

Altho I do get both of what you mean. Yes agree stake money should be increased full stop & yes higher maiden stakes across the board would be great.

Also get your thing re most are not in it for the money, more the thrills.

Edited October 24, 2021 by karrotsishere

[Happy Sunrise]

1 hour ago, karrotsishere said:

Agree after looking at this I was thinking something like from $25k maiden - $35k FFA to say as take away from maiden e.g. $5k so becomes $20k and add to FFA Group 3 so $40k.

They are completing revamping the season so I hope they address stakes as well.

[Lightning Blue]

11 minutes ago, Double R said:

Hi Addy,

I have asked many owners that very question about retaining ownership, and they have said, they want to see them run in the flesh. For many of us, it is not about the stake money, it is our passion, and an interest in our lives.

Cheers.

Robert.

Agree totally with that Robert. Having raced horse in partnerships in NZ, Vic and Qld I always found the Owners always keen to have shares in the horse racing in their own area only. No -one was interested in retaining shares sending to Victoria as not only more expensive , but you just don't see them race. (If living and working Nz,) 

Used to be a progression thing of reach mark in Nz , sell to Vic, reach mark in Vic sell to Qld (then Tas or SA) thankfully Queensland is picking up many kiwi horses straight from your shaky isles now. KIWIS ARE FLYING a prime example , bolting in again last night in 1.54. now 6 from 7 +a 2nd.

old Nz boy NORTHVIEW HUSTLER won the FFA ( beating our local hero COLT THIRTY ONE too. think he's had the biscuit (hasn't won this year shockingly) 

Also the plane -loads of Nz horses sent to WA were purchased for their Local stable clients. They didn't have a requirement for oversea's owners as well.

 

[karrotsishere]

Ps now I for sure know who Addy is 😃

Wow threw me a bit with this thread. 

Ok lets not play the guess who isn't trying game, tomorrow. You might get yourself into trouble 😬 Incase anyone else has figured it out. 

Very funny Addy. Pleased you have joined up here! 😃

 

[Double R]

3 minutes ago, karrotsishere said:

That is what plan to do with Sweetie. Maybe for a season. Make the money in Oz racing then bring her back.

You are losing me here a lil bit Double R, hang you were saying to increase maiden stakes to 30k. And now you are saying its not about the money.

Altho I do get both of what you mean. Yes agree stake money should be increased full stop & yes higher maiden stakes across the board would be great.

Also get your thing re most are not in it for the money.

Hi Karrots.

Sorry to confuse you.

Regardless of the stakes, we are still going to race, and if the stakes were distributed more evenly, it would be a better return for all parties, especially those in the majority, who don't have the good horses.

Cheers.

Robert.

[karrotsishere]

38 minutes ago, Double R said:

Regardless of the stakes, we are still going to race, and if the stakes were distributed more evenly, it would be a better return for all parties, especially those in the majority, who don't have the good horses.

Agree, they did announce some things they were working on re majority R40-R60 with the working groups. Cant recall the name of the incentive scheme. 

It was when they revealed incentives to breeders a bonus and also Country Cups, along with other things. Maybe they might reveal these next week when they reveal the major races dates etc. 

Edited October 24, 2021 by karrotsishere

[Double R]

28 minutes ago, karrotsishere said:

Ps now I for sure know who Addy is 😃

Wow threw me a bit with this thread. 

Ok lets not play the guess who isn't trying game, tomorrow. You might get yourself into trouble 😬 Incase anyone else has figured it out. 

Very funny Addy. Pleased you have joined up here! 😃

 

I am not sure why you need to know who people are Karrots?

Three years ago, Globe and I when were on on Racecafe, I will clean my mouth out, invited members to meet up at the Jewels in Cambridge, and we were the only takers. Apart from that, I have not met anyone on here, and are happy to have conversations about our wonderful sport of racing, and will continue share when I have something racing.

 

[Globederby19]

21 minutes ago, Double R said:

Hi Karrots.

Sorry to confuse you.

Regardless of the stakes, we are still going to race, and if the stakes were distributed more evenly, it would be a better return for all parties, especially those in the majority, who don't have the good horses.

Cheers.

Robert.

Doesn't always work out the way one would think. We were offered big money for MM in his Aussie campaign and it was put to a vote. We said no. Enough purists onboard to want to do the best thing by the horse and keep him with his passionate trainer, regardless of reward, even allowing for the fact he is a top horse.  Personally I wasn't in it for the money, win or lose the buzz from watching your horse/horses run was enough. Not everyone is in that position and it isn't for me to judge someone else for wanting to cash up. I think the stakes available is a sad indictment on NZ racing and its administration in general. 

I remember the days of Hutt Park and the Wgtn Cup , chock full of open class pacers. Sadly with the advent of regionalising the industry and inflating costs the last Cup I remember had C5 pacers running . Loved Hutt Park, beautiful shell grit track, and fast.