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50% reduction in Standing Start Poll


karrotsishere
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Lets move onto standing starts. 

Yes / No

All welcome. 1 poster, 1 vote. Even the loudest voice only gets 1 vote lol.

With a new season approaching 1 Aug. A vote on a 50% reduction in standing starts from the season about to end 31 July 2022.

Globe, myself & Lightening are Yes for change votes. So 3 so far for change.

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Posted (edited)

Ok. Will put you down for change too. As Addington has majority of meetings. Lets say approx 50% less so open for slight room for movement there, more or less. 

For eg Id like to see away with non win trot standing starts & non win pace standing starts. And trots where there is 1 horse on 10metres, just put them on 2nd line mobile or on Unruly mobile start to make it a handicap still & also same thing re pacers. Or make a 3rd line or something behind mobile if its possible (safe).

Edited by karrotsishere
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2 hours ago, karrotsishere said:

Lets move onto standing starts. 

Yes / No

All welcome. 1 poster, 1 vote. Even the loudest voice only gets 1 vote lol.

With a new season approaching 1 Aug. A vote on a 50% reduction in standing starts from the season about to end 31 July 2022.

Globe, myself & Lightening are Yes for change votes. So 3 so far for change.

Definitely, stay as they are.

The majority of standing start races are for trotters, and lets keep it that way.

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Posted (edited)

Excellent another vote in. This 1 for no change, which kicks of the stay as quotas. 

Happy if have got your vote wrong just let me know. 

So far 4 for change

1 against.

More votes welcome. Voting closing in 2 days. Will check back in tomorrow. 

Edited by karrotsishere
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49 minutes ago, Rusty said:

I'd like to see all standing starts abolished, NZ Cup included, and make it a 3200m mobile. 

Do you want handicaps?😂

3 hours ago, karrotsishere said:

For eg Id like to see away with non win trot standing starts & non win pace

It is the same trotters breaking over and over again so the stand should stay.

If a punter is so uninformed that they back a trotter like this then they deserve all they get. Look at Paige last night and was the fav. 

Eliminating the frequent breakers from calculations is a great way of betting.

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3 hours ago, Happy Sunrise said:

a punter is so uninformed that they back a trotter like this then they deserve all they get. 

I would solve that Happy. If you break you are out, full stop, go home and practice some more.  Get the horse up to scratch or else. Brutal but might stop some of the rodeos we watch in Trot races especially. Some breeds are pigs at it, no names but we all know , and that goes through the broodmare ranks as well.

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16 minutes ago, Globederby19 said:

I would solve that Happy. If you break you are out, full stop, go home and practice some more.  Get the horse up to scratch or else. Brutal but might stop some of the rodeos we watch in Trot races especially. Some breeds are pigs at it, no names but we all know , and that goes through the broodmare ranks as well.

I'm pretty sure they do that in France , Globe.

As for my vote ,I'll stay with the status quo.

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7 minutes ago, Globederby19 said:

I would solve that Happy. If you break you are out, full stop, go home and practice some more.  Get the horse up to scratch or else. Brutal but might stop some of the rodeos we watch in Trot races especially. Some breeds are pigs at it, no names but we all know , and that goes through the broodmare ranks as well.

A bit harsh Rees.

I think trotters races these days are much more consistent than back twenty years ago or so. At one stage if you had a trotter that could trot all the way, you were in the money. As Happy said, you know the horses that are consistent offenders, but in general, there is a good chance with age, and experience against race night rivals, it might all come together.

The first horse I had 49 years ago, was a trotter, qualified as a three year, had three starts, and finish near the rear each time through breaking, but with time, and traveling, he eventual won seven races, and raced in the time honoured races.

Just my experience, and observations.

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46 minutes ago, Globederby19 said:

I would solve that Happy. If you break you are out, full stop, go home and practice some more.  Get the horse up to scratch or else. Brutal but might stop some of the rodeos we watch in Trot races especially. Some breeds are pigs at it, no names but we all know , and that goes through the broodmare ranks as well.

Well, we know the stipe's will never do that. There are ample examples of that.

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27 minutes ago, Double R said:

but in general, there is a good chance with age, and experience against race night rivals, it might all come together.

It is actually a skill of betting to identify a trotter whose gait is getting better and realising it is ready to win.

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3 minutes ago, Happy Sunrise said:

It is actually a skill of betting to identify a trotter whose gait is getting better and realising it is ready to win.

That's fine for the experienced punter. but here we are talking about promoting the sport to a wider audience and bringing in less experienced punters. 

Its a bit of damned if you do and damned if you don't.

Sorry Robert, yes a bit tongue in cheek but it is standard practice in Europe. The Franco/American influence in our stock has helped but there are still anomallys.

There are certain breeds I would stay well clear of, when punting or if I decided to get back into ownership.

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Methven TC, who have tried to be innovative with their programming still have short course stands over a mile or 1700 in their twilight meeting.

I would think they would be trying to meet the need of horses or trainers would they not?

Always a place for stands but an even bigger place for a good starter.

 

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12 minutes ago, Happy Sunrise said:

Methven TC, who have tried to be innovative with their programming still have short course stands over a mile or 1700 in their twilight meeting.

Exactly. Mile stands , really. We are still stuck in the early part of last century. A complete joke. America and Canada introduced Mobiles in 1946. NZ nearly a 100 yrs behind ffs. 

Sorry,  but I doubt I will see the abolition of standing starts in my life time in this country. 

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8 hours ago, karrotsishere said:

Ok. Will put you down for change too. As Addington has majority of meetings. Lets say approx 50% less so open for slight room for movement there, more or less. 

For eg Id like to see away with non win trot standing starts & non win pace standing starts. And trots where there is 1 horse on 10metres, just put them on 2nd line mobile or on Unruly mobile start to make it a handicap still & also same thing re pacers. Or make a 3rd line or something behind mobile if its possible (safe).

For non win trots. Probably good think for education and manners moving forward. You have say half and half standing starts.

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2 hours ago, Double R said:

A bit harsh Rees.

I think trotters races these days are much more consistent than back twenty years ago or so. At one stage if you had a trotter that could trot all the way, you were in the money. As Happy said, you know the horses that are consistent offenders, but in general, there is a good chance with age, and experience against race night rivals, it might all come together.

The first horse I had 49 years ago, was a trotter, qualified as a three year, had three starts, and finish near the rear each time through breaking, but with time, and traveling, he eventual won seven races, and raced in the time honoured races.

Just my experience, and observations.

Agree fully , quite important for there education and manners. Than crazy trotters than never properly develop.

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1 hour ago, Globederby19 said:

Exactly. Mile stands , really. We are still stuck in the early part of last century. A complete joke. America and Canada introduced Mobiles in 1946. NZ nearly a 100 yrs behind ffs. 

Sorry,  but I doubt I will see the abolition of standing starts in my life time in this country. 

So why Methven do them then?

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1 hour ago, Gospel Of Judas said:

Agree fully , quite important for there education and manners. Than crazy trotters than never properly develop.

They will develop , just not at the expense of those betting on them. Educate them properly away from race day, otherwise pay the penalty of disq.  Its hard enough to squeeze the discretionary dollar out of anyone these days, watching breaking hoses is not conducive to that. 

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10 hours ago, Globederby19 said:

They will develop , just not at the expense of those betting on them. Educate them properly away from race day, otherwise pay the penalty of disq.  Its hard enough to squeeze the discretionary dollar out of anyone these days, watching breaking hoses is not conducive to that. 

It is very hard to educate them thoroughly when there are no workouts and trials at night, when a lot of the races are at night time, so the experience has to be gained on race night.

As with any form of gambling, " you pay your money, and take your chances".

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Vote update with 800m to go its another tight race 5 against 4 for change so far. Happy have switched you to status quo. GOS have put you for change re your quote "you have say half & half stands". If not correct then it swings the other way, against would lead so just sing out if wrong.

Those say I - Karrots, Globe, Lightening, Rusty, GOS

Those say Nah - DR, Happy, Parsnip, Craig

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Posted (edited)

Ill quickly do 1 other small poll here too. (Close tomorrow also)

For or against change.

Change be - no potential conflict of interest in certain influencial employment positions. Shouldnt be allowed to own a horse during their employment term. 

Eg CEO, TAB person who sets prices.  

I vote for change. 

Edited by karrotsishere
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6 minutes ago, karrotsishere said:

Vote update with 800m to go its another tight race 5 against 4 for change so far. Happy have switched you to status quo. GOS have put you for change re your quote "you have say half & half stands". If not correct then it swings the other way, against would lead so just sing out if wrong.

It is not really a matter of being absolute eg no stands at all. It is about finding what is best for harness racing. 

Does having standing starts assist horses? I think I see trainers reluctant to start their horses in mobiles, why is that? Why do Methven TC programme stands?

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