PWJ Posted December 10, 2021 Author Share Posted December 10, 2021 2 minutes ago, Globederby19 said: No Excuses Needed was born in 1998. Allowing for a 36 yr old horse, about, the horse in the B&W picture would have been around in the sixty's, late 50,s . That picture looks earlier than that. ??. Zabeel maybe. It was when the trainer was born not the horse Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PWJ Posted December 10, 2021 Author Share Posted December 10, 2021 4 minutes ago, Globederby19 said: No Excuses Needed was born in 1998. Allowing for a 36 yr old horse, about, the horse in the B&W picture would have been around in the sixty's, late 50,s . That picture looks earlier than that. ??. Zabeel maybe. No it's not "Gee". Not sure Peak has a lot of Zabeel in him Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete Posted December 10, 2021 Share Posted December 10, 2021 Peat Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ngakonui grass Posted December 10, 2021 Share Posted December 10, 2021 Stoute was born 22/10/45. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Globederby19 Posted December 10, 2021 Share Posted December 10, 2021 Sir Michael Stoute, so that makes the B&W picture about 1909 or 10. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Globederby19 Posted December 10, 2021 Share Posted December 10, 2021 I keep sniffing Northern Dancer here somewhere.! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ngakonui grass Posted December 10, 2021 Share Posted December 10, 2021 6 minutes ago, Globederby19 said: Sir Michael Stoute, so that makes the B&W picture about 1909 or 10. where is 36years old mentioned,may have missed it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
craigos1 Posted December 10, 2021 Share Posted December 10, 2021 Von Cettes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Globederby19 Posted December 10, 2021 Share Posted December 10, 2021 1 hour ago, Globederby19 said: Sir Michael Stoute, so that makes the B&W picture about 1909 or 10. Actually the horses age isn't known in the picture and 1909 would be about the horses birth time so could be anywhere between 1913 and 1923. The rabbit hole is getting deeper. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Globederby19 Posted December 10, 2021 Share Posted December 10, 2021 Is the horse in the picture Phar Lap ,PJ?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackie Posted December 10, 2021 Share Posted December 10, 2021 Ok PWJ That horse is Craig an Eran, who's owner was Waldorf Aster. His wife was Nancy Astor, the first female seated Member of Parliament. Now, go to work Globederby19, and see what you can find in his pedigree somewhere related to those other two. I see he did end upin France and was euthinased there o n Sir Michael Stoute's birthday. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackie Posted December 10, 2021 Share Posted December 10, 2021 (edited) Maybe they are all inbred 4 x 4 as he was to Bend Or She is inbred 4 × 4 to the mare Cotehele House. Edited December 10, 2021 by Blackie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Globederby19 Posted December 10, 2021 Share Posted December 10, 2021 4 minutes ago, Blackie said: Maybe they are all inbred 4 x 4 as he was to Bend Or Back in 1877, dear me. Might as well just say they all stem from the same Arabian and Turk stock Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackie Posted December 10, 2021 Share Posted December 10, 2021 Peak 4 x 4 to Speedy Scot? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackie Posted December 10, 2021 Share Posted December 10, 2021 (edited) I think we may have cracked it. Edited December 10, 2021 by Blackie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Globederby19 Posted December 10, 2021 Share Posted December 10, 2021 Godolphin Arabian ---Messenger----- Speedy Scot----Peak Hambiltonian---Speedy Scott----Peak Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PWJ Posted December 11, 2021 Author Share Posted December 11, 2021 On 12/10/2021 at 7:08 PM, Blackie said: Ok PWJ That horse is Craig an Eran, who's owner was Waldorf Aster. His wife was Nancy Astor, the first female seated Member of Parliament. Now, go to work Globederby19, and see what you can find in his pedigree somewhere related to those other two. I see he did end upin France and was euthinased there o n Sir Michael Stoute's birthday. 100% correct Blackie ! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PWJ Posted December 11, 2021 Author Share Posted December 11, 2021 Just now, PWJ said: 100% correct Blackie ! Now find the connection Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PWJ Posted December 12, 2021 Author Share Posted December 12, 2021 Today's clue - who do you Turn-to when Gladys's daughter met Abner Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ngakonui grass Posted December 13, 2021 Share Posted December 13, 2021 5 hours ago, PWJ said: Today's clue - who do you Turn-to when Gladys's daughter met Abner Is that a reference to Bewitched? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PWJ Posted December 13, 2021 Author Share Posted December 13, 2021 18 hours ago, ngakonui grass said: Is that a reference to Bewitched? No but we could be talking about a big moon, by Jove Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackie Posted December 14, 2021 Share Posted December 14, 2021 (edited) Craig an Eran appears in both of Peak's and Verry Elleegant's pedigree. Bear with: Craig an Eran: sire of Gladys - dam of Dladys - dam of Ninia - dam of Caprior - sire of Nesmile - dam of Buvetier Daunou - sire of Ganymede - sire of Peak Craig an Eran:sire of Admiral Drake - sire of Source Sucree - sire of Turn To Be - sire of Sir Gaylord - sire of Sir Ivor - sire of Sir Tristram - sire of Zabeel - sire of Zed - sire of Verry Elleegant Interesting to note that they were experimenting with breeding from a trotting bred mare, with a thoroughbred sire way back then, it is thought to inject some speed. The horse most recently I can think of is Kata Hoiho, maybe Jim Dalgety was experimenting with the idea, who won a few races back in the 1980's, who was out of a mare, out of a mare by a thoroughbred so once removed. I'm not sure of the rule as of now, I suppose it could still be done I need a drink 😷 Edited December 14, 2021 by Blackie 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackie Posted December 14, 2021 Share Posted December 14, 2021 ps do I get my hat?😇 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PWJ Posted December 14, 2021 Author Share Posted December 14, 2021 38 minutes ago, Blackie said: Craig an Eran appears in both of Peak's and Verry Elleegant's pedigree. Bear with: Craig an Eran: sire of Gladys - dam of Dladys - dam of Ninia - dam of Caprior - sire of Nesmile - dam of Buvetier Daunou - sire of Ganymede - sire of Peak Craig an Eran:sire of Admiral Drake - sire of Source Sucree - sire of Turn To Be - sire of Sir Gaylord - sire of Sir Ivor - sire of Sir Tristram - sire of Zabeel - sire of Zed - sire of Verry Elleegant Interesting to note that they were experimenting with breeding from a trotting bred mare, with a thoroughbred sire way back then, it is thought to inject some speed. The horse most recently I can think of is Kata Hoiho, maybe Jim Dalgety was experimenting with the idea, who won a few races back in the 1980's, who was out of a mare, out of a mare by a thoroughbred so once removed. I'm not sure of the rule as of now, I suppose it could still be done I need a drink 😷 Outstanding Blackie - all 100% correct ! Did my clues help ? Yes you get a hat-please PM me with your name and mailing address and I will send it. Cheers PJ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackie Posted December 14, 2021 Share Posted December 14, 2021 Yes, clues helped PJ, big moon indeed, very good by the way 👍, though had to go delving deep. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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