Will Racing Die

[VC!]

2 hours ago, Hesi said:

 

Mardi has often talked about increasing net betting revenue, as the only way this industry can survive

That’s not going to happen in NZ

Covid 19 has brought about the opportunity to reboot 

Bart Cummings once said the most important person in racing is the punter, would the most important person inside a casino be the punter? especially with some additional alcohol in their system, I personally detest poker machines 

As for T Pike I couldn’t see him relocating he has an All Weather track at his beckon call, his potential good crop of thoroughbred’s will do all their early work at Cambridge maybe have a lead up run at a local meet or a trial or two, then aimed at the Sydney Spring or Autumn carnivals or Melbourne Spring or Brisbane Winter Carnival just over an hour drive to Auckland International away you go, great place to train horses Cambridge open spaces lovely paddocks same goes for Murray Baker Bjorn has some spare boxes, done a great job winning the Derby while daddy watched from home

Also horses that need time to mature and develop you can’t get a better place than NZ have a few runs in NZ put them out bring them back

So what about the rest of the trainers in NZ???

[mardigras]

 

2 hours ago, Hesi said:

Mardi has often talked about increasing net betting revenue, as the only way this industry can survive

30 minutes ago, VC! said:

That’s not going to happen in NZ

You're probably right - at least in the short term. But if you can't do that, then you realistically have to shrink what that betting revenue can do for you. It's not a good plan to continue to run an industry with outgoings of $x million if income is $x /2 million. I don't think that works well.

They could increase NZ betting revenue slowly by improving the NZ attraction relative to the competition - in order to shift revenue from one area to another. They haven't shown an appetite to do that.

The generation thing is going to be a factor. So you have to at least do the best you can to identify a means of doing something that will attract the various generations. Many have suggested a number of things - like barry's idea to run racing over shorter timeframes. All these things of the past like golf, many won't play because of the time it takes.

I'm not suggesting one idea here or there can make the changes required, it would need some clever thinking and input even from the target group - something we hardly do - and BGP is one avenue where the various generations probably exists.

There's a massive disjoint between the supposed goals of the TAB and the needs of the industry. Something has to give or if it doesn't, we will always be in the state we are in, and the various revenue streams of the TAB will be ever increasing in order to try and at least keep the industry going. Which is a cost to the taxpayer of NZ.

 

[VC!]

11 minutes ago, mardigras said:

 

like barry's idea to run racing over shorter timeframes. All these things of the past like golf, many won't play because of the time it takes.

That’s a no brainer 25 minute intervals would be great 30 max who wants to sit in the grandstand and watch the grass grow, you just need to look at Test cricket a game for the purists then look at T20 supported by the younger generation 

As for Golf you can play 9 hole golf courses, golf is an extremely popular sport, great for exercise they have not long opened up a theme park type of golf driving range restaurant/drinks called Top Golf on the Gold Coast which is extremely difficult to secure a booking in hindsight your golf theory is correct but with innovative thinking you can develop something that is far more attractive to the younger generation eg Top Golf which includes dining and drinking as you play

[mardigras]

12 minutes ago, VC! said:

That’s a no brainer 25 minute intervals would be great 30 max who wants to sit in the grandstand and watch the grass grow, you just need to look at Test cricket a game for the purists then look at T20 supported by the younger generation 

As for Golf you can play 9 hole golf courses, golf is an extremely popular sport, great for exercise they have not long opened up a theme park type of golf driving range restaurant/drinks called Top Golf on the Gold Coast which is extremely difficult to secure a booking in hindsight your golf theory is correct but with innovative thinking you can develop something that is far more attractive to the younger generation eg Top Golf which includes dining and drinking as you play

True VC - but with golf - that has meant evolving things. And good on them. I'm not anti golf by the way, I've played for years in the past and love it, although I no longer play. Even managed to get to a US Open one year. Brilliant.

[Globederby19]

4 hours ago, VC! said:

Also horses that need time to mature and develop you can’t get a better place than NZ have a few runs in NZ put them out bring them back

Very true. My son in law trains right nxt door to Pikes establishment. Trot the horses across the road to the track, swimmer just across the road and Artificial track to come. 

If it wasn't for his dedicated syndicate owners I am not sure how he would survive apart from becoming a trader again.

But it raises the specter of NZ becoming a nursery only , growing and nursing horses through the early stages. Any with ability are soon off overseas, and we get left with the dun-age, on whom a dwindling betting market are asked to support and follow. Bit like raising chickens . 

[Hesi]

28 minutes ago, Globederby19 said:

Very true. My son in law trains right nxt door to Pikes establishment. Trot the horses across the road to the track, swimmer just across the road and Artificial track to come. 

If it wasn't for his dedicated syndicate owners I am not sure how he would survive apart from becoming a trader again.

But it raises the specter of NZ becoming a nursery only , growing and nursing horses through the early stages. Any with ability are soon off overseas, and we get left with the dun-age, on whom a dwindling betting market are asked to support and follow. Bit like raising chickens . 

Good article about him Rees, he seems pretty well set up and positive about his future, because of his, as you say, dedicated syndicate owners, but racing in NZ appears for him, to only be a limited thing in the future

https://loveracing.nz/News/30194/Re-chargedCampbellreadyforfreshstart.aspx

[Hesi]

I notice also, Stephen Marsh, saying it all comes down to stake levels, as to whether he looks to Aus

[Hesi]

Anyone game enough to put together a realistic budget for RITA for 20/21

Net betting revenue(including tote, fixed, sports and overseas), break it down if you want

Operating related costs

Fixed costs(mainly staff)

Debt repayment allocation for the year

Gross profit

Payments to racing

- thoroughbred

- harness

- dogs

RIU allocation

 

[Freda]

Don't forget Rita will be disestablished come July 31st...unless timeframes are pushed out.

[Hesi]

Just reading through stuff relating the The Racing Industry Bill 2019

Would this infer, that money used from the sale of assets, could be used for things other than infrastructure revitalisation

Two property objectives are proposed to guide the contribution of racing property to industry revitalisation

4. agree that two property objectives be included in the purpose statement of the Racing Act 2003 (the Act) to guide decision-making regarding racing property:

4.1 the value of racing property should be retained in the industry; and

4.2 the value of racing property should be used for maximum industry benefit;

 

[curious]

What is racing property as opposed to community property for example?

[ngakonui grass]

2 hours ago, Hesi said:

I notice also, Stephen Marsh, saying it all comes down to stake levels, as to whether he looks to Aus

Hard to believe Marsh will go anywhere with his interest in a spelling property,partner riding well and plenty of horses.

[curious]

Hmmmm ...

RITA had not disclosed its true financial position and had failed to fund the codes as intended due to its lack of cash flow prior to level 4 lockdown.

[Hesi]

14 minutes ago, ngakonui grass said:

Hard to believe Marsh will go anywhere with his interest in a spelling property,partner riding well and plenty of horses.

While Marsh is looking forward to the resumption of racing, he is wary about the potential drop in stakes money and said a move across the Tasman is possible if prizemoney dived.

 

“I am probably more looking forward to seeing what the stake money is like to see if it is worth training here,” he said.

 

“If the stake money drops, you have got to consider Australia, because if we don’t, all of our owners will be and we could lose the lot.

 

“I know Australia’s (prizemoney) has dropped a little bit, but we can’t afford to drop.

 

“I am very interested to see the new stake money and I am very worried about it.”

[mardigras]

9 minutes ago, curious said:

Hmmmm ...

RITA had not disclosed its true financial position and had failed to fund the codes as intended due to its lack of cash flow prior to level 4 lockdown.

Where was this from curious? Sounds very poor form.

[curious]

1 minute ago, mardigras said:

Where was this from curious? Sounds very poor form.

https://www.lincolnfarms.co.nz/stories/owners-muscle-up-oia-request-for-answers-from-rita-could-fuel-judicial-action/

[mardigras]

5 minutes ago, curious said:

https://www.lincolnfarms.co.nz/stories/owners-muscle-up-oia-request-for-answers-from-rita-could-fuel-judicial-action/

So more a statement than a fact? As I gather they are still awaiting a response. If it is the case, then I'm not sure if there is a bright side.

[curious]

7 minutes ago, mardigras said:

So more a statement than a fact? As I gather they are still awaiting a response. If it is the case, then I'm not sure if there is a bright side.

Me neither. If it's that dire and was before the lockdown, then the whole show may be belly up. Possibly why we still haven't seen the 6 month financials.

I'm assuming that the statement that Rita has failed to fund the codes as intended due to its lack of cash flow prior to level 4 lockdown has been verified.

Edited April 27, 2020 by curious

[mardigras]

14 minutes ago, curious said:

Me neither. If it's that dire and was before the lockdown, then the whole show may be belly up. Possibly why we still haven't seen the 6 month financials.

I'm assuming that the statement that Rita has failed to fund the codes as intended due to its lack of cash flow prior to level 4 lockdown has been verified.

Yes, prior to Covid, from looking at the marketplace and a few other things, I had formed a view that things were not that rosy from a ROI perspective. Couple that feeling with a real lack of openness, and it gives me an overall feeling of 'oh no'. I'd agree the statement would have to have been verified, which doesn't make for any confidence.

[curious]

5 minutes ago, mardigras said:

Yes, prior to Covid, from looking at the marketplace and a few other things, I had formed a view that things were not that rosy from a ROI perspective. Couple that feeling with a real lack of openness, and it gives me an overall feeling of 'oh no'. I'd agree the statement would have to have been verified, which doesn't make for any confidence.

Makes me think that RITA will have nothing to hand over in July and at least a year's holiday is on the cards, same as international tourism, hard copy media, a lot of hospitality etc. All already en route but the deal now sealed.

[Hesi]

Refreshing to see big players like, Lincoln Farms, John Street and Barry Lichter getting so active.

Clearly they kowtow to no one, unlike the breeders, Te Akau and NZB

Would you have ever seen this sort of stuff come from Te Akau, not in a million years

[curious]

1 hour ago, Hesi said:

Refreshing to see big players like, Lincoln Farms, John Street and Barry Lichter getting so active.

Clearly they kowtow to no one, unlike the breeders, Te Akau and NZB

Would you have ever seen this sort of stuff come from Te Akau, not in a million years

Might be a few sleepless nights for the RITA directors right now if they are trading while insolvent and have incurred an obligation which they couldn't/haven't performed? Especially if they can't blame the lock down and the situation preceded that. Might be personally liable and have to stump up with the cash?

Same could apply to NZTR?

Edited April 27, 2020 by curious

[mardigras]

Can't say too much really except it's a general thing - so I wouldn't point the finger at racing industry as a group. Having read that thread, I do struggle to understand how anyone who claims to bet sufficiently to withdraw x periodically, would be so clueless on reading a statement from his account.

I'm sure there are also plenty that shake their heads after reading what I write. I was told the other day that pretty much my views were worthless and I should restrict my self to playing with train sets (or words to that effect). 

[Hesi]

11 minutes ago, mardigras said:

Can't say too much really except it's a general thing - so I wouldn't point the finger at racing industry as a group. Having read that thread, I do struggle to understand how anyone who claims to bet sufficiently to withdraw x periodically, would be so clueless on reading a statement from his account.

I'm sure there are also plenty that shake their heads after reading what I write. I was told the other day that pretty much my views were worthless and I should restrict my self to playing with train sets (or words to that effect). 

I would say a comment like that reflects more on the person saying it than the person it is directed towards.  If it is the person and comment I am thinking of, then that person is renowned for making outrageous posts.

Keep going Mardi, I think of all the posts made about the Covid situation, you rightly put the emphasis on the need to avoid a critical impaction on the health system, that could then not cope, and the effect that might then have

[curious]

12 hours ago, Freda said:

Don't forget Rita will be disestablished come July 31st...unless timeframes are pushed out.

Might not be anything to disestablish by then.