pete Posted January 18 Share Posted January 18 Would you pay $57,125 for a 2.5% share of a yearling? Even if I had that kind of money to splash around I know what my answer would be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dancing Show Posted January 18 Share Posted January 18 Who is the yearling? 🙂 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete Posted January 18 Author Share Posted January 18 Te Akau purchased a Wootton Bassett - Avantage filly from Coolmore for AUD 2.1 million and are syndicating her. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete Posted January 18 Author Share Posted January 18 This isn't a Te Akau beat up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dancing Show Posted January 18 Share Posted January 18 I've just looked at the pedigrees .. doesn't do much for me and is not something I'd be interested in other than the Secretariat in the broodmare line of Wootton Bassett, but I guess a lot is resting on Avantage. As Colin Jillings used to say.. 70% is the broodmare 🙂 . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maximus Posted January 18 Share Posted January 18 Secretariat....aaahhhh! Just the thought of him brings joy to Maxi's world. MM 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hesi Posted January 18 Share Posted January 18 2 hours ago, pete said: Would you pay $57,125 for a 2.5% share of a yearling? Even if I had that kind of money to splash around I know what my answer would be. No, but then TA wants to win the 2-year-old million each year, that is the motivation, that is the sales spiel Looking at Boxing Day races, some pretty classy horseflesh went for a lot less Wild Night - 50k Pendragon - 110k Campionessa - 60k Molly Bloom - 150k Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dancing Show Posted January 18 Share Posted January 18 1 hour ago, Maximus said: Secretariat....aaahhhh! Just the thought of him brings joy to Maxi's world. MM Oh happy days!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Midnight Caller Posted January 18 Share Posted January 18 2 hours ago, pete said: Would you pay $57,125 for a 2.5% share of a yearling? Even if I had that kind of money to splash around I know what my answer would be. Not for 2.5%, although I have had 10% in a few slow ones!😀 The TA/Coolmore partnership should get more than their money back with the progeny over time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buller Rep Posted January 18 Share Posted January 18 I wouldn’t in a filly but a colt possibly if I had the money. However having said that in the 300k to 700k market in Australia (MM and Inglis) I think that the fillies overall offer a better risk verse’s investment. Disclosure: I’ve just invested (5%) in a MM Filly (with Australian Bloodstock) to be trained by Gerard Ryan at a fraction of that money and the dam won 8 races and $500k in the USA. Wish me luck 😂 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buller Rep Posted January 18 Share Posted January 18 1 hour ago, Maximus said: Secretariat....aaahhhh! Just the thought of him brings joy to Maxi's world. MM Believe it or not Secretariat had his first start over the long weekend of Thanksgiving at Aqueduct NY in 1971. Anyway I went to the Saturday meet and I think Secretariat started on the Monday or vice versa! All was not completely lost as 8 to 10 years later I was able to visit Mill Reef and Brigadier Gerard in Newmarket and only 6 years ago we went and saw Frankel at Banstead Manor Newmarket! I guess that I’ve been blessed in a few things horse wise! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hesi Posted January 18 Share Posted January 18 2 hours ago, Buller Rep said: I wouldn’t in a filly but a colt possibly if I had the money. However having said that in the 300k to 700k market in Australia (MM and Inglis) I think that the fillies overall offer a better risk verse’s investment. Disclosure: I’ve just invested (5%) in a MM Filly (with Australian Bloodstock) to be trained by Gerard Ryan at a fraction of that money and the dam won 8 races and $500k in the USA. Wish me luck 😂 Good luck, unfortunately you missed out on the Remutaka Classic, but I'm sure you will enjoy Sat anyway. Ellis is spending up large, it is all part of the TA modus operandi. Even though Veandercross was bought for $1500, nowadays to convince big time syndicate holders you have the horse to win the big races, you have to have the high purchase price. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete Posted January 18 Author Share Posted January 18 I think the risk for me would be that top class racemares don't seem to produce high class offspring very much. I'm wondering how the syndicate owners who got into the Wolverine syndicate are feeling at the moment. She looks headed for the broodmare paddock in my opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hesi Posted January 18 Share Posted January 18 Sunline and Black Caviar spring to mind Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete Posted January 18 Author Share Posted January 18 Remember Sun Ruler? Zabeel - Sunline. Should've been a champion on that. Total dud both on and off the track. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hesi Posted January 18 Share Posted January 18 PJ is without doubt the the breeding expert, I wonder what his view is on prices and how to shorten the odds of getting a good one Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dancing Show Posted January 18 Share Posted January 18 1 hour ago, pete said: I think the risk for me would be that top class racemares don't seem to produce high class offspring very much. I'm wondering how the syndicate owners who got into the Wolverine syndicate are feeling at the moment. She looks headed for the broodmare paddock in my opinion. True, I personally tend to think broodmares are often better with less racing or no racing at all ie. Parfore, Eight Carat. As you say some of the bigger names that have retired later in their racing careers haven't produced to expectations. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dancing Show Posted January 18 Share Posted January 18 Other successful broodmares that fit with the lesser racing category - Sayyida, Meleka Belle. Hunza was a very good racehorse, but still produced well. Only had 10 or so starts though before moving to the broodmare paddock. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ngakonui grass Posted January 18 Share Posted January 18 omo but i think before going to stud mares that have just finished racing should have a season off before being served.Many mares that finish racing go straight to the stallion,where as i believe they should have a good break. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete Posted January 19 Author Share Posted January 19 20 minutes ago, ngakonui grass said: omo but i think before going to stud mares that have just finished racing should have a season off before being served.Many mares that finish racing go straight to the stallion,where as i believe they should have a good break. Your post got me thinking about the old adage about mares improving whilst racing when in foal. I always felt that was the case but this article uses statistics to prove otherwise. Interesting. https://www.thoroughbreddailynews.com/do-fillies-really-improve-when-racing-in-foal/ 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Castleton Posted January 19 Share Posted January 19 Be nice to win a share of next Thursday's Powerball 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mardigras Posted January 19 Share Posted January 19 1 hour ago, pete said: Your post got me thinking about the old adage about mares improving whilst racing when in foal. I always felt that was the case but this article uses statistics to prove otherwise. Interesting. https://www.thoroughbreddailynews.com/do-fillies-really-improve-when-racing-in-foal/ In my view, the use of statistics in horse racing is the biggest reason punters are unable to change their approach and ultimately win. Trainer stats, jockey stats, course stats, winning stats, breeding stats, barrier stats, track condition stats, distance stats, age stats, gender stats, gear change stats, weight stats - all used extensively, but telling you very little in relation to chance of a horse. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Globederby19 Posted January 19 Share Posted January 19 My take on it and I am using experience here talking to my son in law is that (and PJ may agree here) a horse can be selected on confirmation first and then pedigree. Pedigree alone guarantees nothing. Andrew only has a cursory look at the sales catalogue, and then views every horse and makes notes, which he takes into the auction ring. Tavistock was a prime example of sight first and bought on that premise, and the fairy tale began. $57 grand for 2.5% share in a nag chosen by someone you don't know ,relying on their reputation alone, a yearling to boot, so anything can go wrong before it hits the track so its potentially a money hole. . My presumption is that there is no insurance on your investment, someone could elaborate for me on that. It never ceases to amaze me the amount money spent on thoroughbreds. Much cheaper for us gypsies. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hesi Posted January 19 Share Posted January 19 1 hour ago, mardigras said: In my view, the use of statistics in horse racing is the biggest reason punters are unable to change their approach and ultimately win. Trainer stats, jockey stats, course stats, winning stats, breeding stats, barrier stats, track condition stats, distance stats, age stats, gender stats, gear change stats, weight stats - all used extensively, but telling you very little in relation to chance of a horse. I suppose it is like tossing a coin 5 times, the chances of it being heads 5 times is 1 in 32. The chance of the 6th. throw being a head is still 1 in 2, but the chance of throwing 6 heads is 1 in 64 Relating it to horse racing, too much weighting is given to previous factors. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mardigras Posted January 19 Share Posted January 19 9 minutes ago, Hesi said: I suppose it is like tossing a coin 5 times, the chances of it being heads 5 times is 1 in 32. The chance of the 6th. throw being a head is still 1 in 2, but the chance of throwing 6 heads is 1 in 64 Relating it to horse racing, too much weighting is given to previous factors. In the case of tossing a coin, to decide head/tail each has a 50% chance is based on knowing all there is to know about the coin and the tossing of it. In the case of horse racing, the statistic has no relationship with chance. With the coin toss it does. i.e. a future coin toss has a 50% chance of being a head. Statistics say that the chance of a coin toss being a head is 50%. The statistic aligns with the future chance. In horse racing, none of the statistics relating to horse racing correlate to the chance of a horse in a future event. Except for those where the statistic says there is zero chance or 100% chance. e.g. The statistic that says that 100% of the races run with one horse are won by the entrant (although in reality it might fall over/die etc). So if you get to bet on a race with only one entrant and you get better than your money back for backing it to win, the statistic would be useful. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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