All things Covid and Political discussion .........Be Kind

[karrotsishere]

29 minutes ago, Maximus said:

what were the side effects?

Everyone is different. For me 1st jab, nothing bar sore arm, 2nd jab sore arm + heart palpations, bed ridden, flu like symptoms including achy body, had sharp pains thru-out body in different random places, slight headache, tired. Lastly only 24 hours. And occurred approx 8-10 ish hours after jab. 

Read after this that the more side-effects you have the more effective it will be. 

Will perhaps post after Booster to give feedback, will be interesting if get any side effects or not. 

Im in good health. Have had a post checkup with all bloods including heart check. All come back clear and good. 

[Double R]

3 minutes ago, karrotsishere said:

Everyone is different. For me 1st jab, nothing bar sore arm, 2nd jab sore arm + heart palpations, bed ridden, flu like symptoms including achy body, had sharp pains thru-out body in different random places, slight headache, tired. Lastly only 24 hours. And occurred approx 8-10 ish hours after jab. 

Read after this that the more side-effects you have the more effective it will be. 

Will perhaps post after Booster to give feedback, will be interesting if get any side effects or not. 

Im in good health. Have had a post checkup with all bloods including heart check. All come back clear and good. 

Wishing you a smooth path ahead after your booster today Karrots.

Are you sure they were not side effects from joining this site??? HaHa!!!

[Maximus]

1 hour ago, Double R said:

Wishing you a smooth path ahead after your booster today Karrots.

Are you sure they were not side effects from joining this site??? HaHa!!!

 

1 hour ago, Double R said:

Wishing you a smooth path ahead after your booster today Karrots.

Are you sure they were not side effects from joining this site??? HaHa!!!

good on you for sharing that info, karrots, Max should have said "if you don't mind my asking". Max his-self is not due for the booster til January but can say that the immediate side effects of the 1st jab were ...nil, and the 2nd jab side effects were ..nil. Not even a sore arm. Maybe an ever-so-slightly runny nose, intermittently, but how do you know they arent the result of something else?

One of Max's rellies is very hesitant about the jabs and reads far too much stuff online...as I said to her recently: if I get the jabs and then contract some debilitating disorder/disease woteva, how does anyone know if it's the result of the vaccine?

Best wishes to you for booster.

MM

[brown fox]

Like Maxie nil side affects from both Jabs.Maybe years of competing in P.J.s comps. has toughened us up😁

[karrotsishere]

Many thanks guys. Will post in approx 48 hours if any effect or not. Actually went in with work collegues (hence got in earlier than most), both 2 initial jabs & we were allocated the same time to go. 4 went thru at some timeframe as me 1st jab. Not one of us got side effects. Same group 2nd jab same timeframe again & 2 of the 4 got side effects. The other aside from me with side effects that occurred that nite too, had similar to me, but got the chills, which I didn't get, but they also too tired, heart palpations etc. Read afterwards that those side effects are common amongst those that said they got side effects.

So yeah lets see. Think I only joined site last month ha, time flies when having fun. 

Great you guys didn't get them! 

[Maximus]

Max notes that Mr Hipkins is spouting forth that Omicron variant is bound to show up in MIQ.

Well, we know how that is going to end, don't we, Minister ...it will get out just like Delta did because of your completely stupid system and hopeless decision-making.

P'raps MIQ doesn't matter any more because people with Omicron (not knowing they've got it) are going to be self-isolating in their hundreds/thousands next year anyway, so it'll get out that way.

The most disappointing thing of all this is that this Government has had over 18 months to prepare Kiwis for Covid and have failed miserably, despite spending  BILLIONS and wrecking the lives of countless SMEs and the people who work in them. Apparently we do not have one more ICU bed than we had 18 months ago, and an overstressed under-resourced health workforce. And that's without large numbers of hospitalisations/deaths. 

MM

[mardigras]

It doesn't make much difference when you have people like Aquaman on another channel seriously on another planet.

He is the archetypal conspiracy theorist. Most others can't come close. His rare valid arguments are lost in his obsession. He's the kind of person that believes stuff simply because he reads it on one of his websites. 

I almost feel sympathy for the government's poor handling of things knowing they have to deal with the likes of that.

I agree that forcing people to vaccinate is absolutely the wrong move. But the idea that various elements are in the vaccine and it will kill more people than the virus is not supported by any real data. Vaccinating young people may also not be based on any science, but the claims of relative deaths are simply anecdotal.

But he uses those things to somehow push an argument that has no basis - rather than sticking to his stance of not wanting the vaccine.

I support his stance of not wanting the vaccine, as I say, it should be individual choice. But he is incapable of simply making that choice and feels the need to push theories that I haven't seen anything supporting them.

He thinks he has to make it about the vaccine is poison, kills more than the vaccine, contains harmful elements, is about a 'New World' order. He should wear an aluminium hat so he can easily be identified. That way his natural immunity will not be compromised.

I also love those people that look at the NZ situation as if that actually means anything from the point of view of the risks of the virus. He doesn't understand data, but supports data that aligns with his views. 

Anyone that looks more closely at the data, wouldn't call Covid a cold or a mild flu. It is not a world killer, but is at a level massively beyond a bad flu. I'd say around 6 - 10 times a typical flu - and 2 - 3 times a very bad flu (on basic analysis). The real issue is that the flu is normally a big killer in areas such as Africa. And are massively estimated. Most of the perceived Covid deaths are not in Africa. 

By the way, his posts actually crack me up. 

Edited December 1, 2021 by mardigras

[Freda]

9 hours ago, mardigras said:

It doesn't make much difference when you have people like Aquaman on another channel seriously on another planet.

He is the archetypal conspiracy theorist. Most others can't come close. His rare valid arguments are lost in his obsession. He's the kind of person that believes stuff simply because he reads it on one of his websites. 

I almost feel sympathy for the government's poor handling of things knowing they have to deal with the likes of that.

I agree that forcing people to vaccinate is absolutely the wrong move. But the idea that various elements are in the vaccine and it will kill more people than the virus is not supported by any real data. Vaccinating young people may also not be based on any science, but the claims of relative deaths are simply anecdotal.

But he uses those things to somehow push an argument that has no basis - rather than sticking to his stance of not wanting the vaccine.

I support his stance of not wanting the vaccine, as I say, it should be individual choice. But he is incapable of simply making that choice and feels the need to push theories that I haven't seen anything supporting them.

He thinks he has to make it about the vaccine is poison, kills more than the vaccine, contains harmful elements, is about a 'New World' order. He should wear an aluminium hat so he can easily be identified. That way his natural immunity will not be compromised.

I also love those people that look at the NZ situation as if that actually means anything from the point of view of the risks of the virus. He doesn't understand data, but supports data that aligns with his views. 

Anyone that looks more closely at the data, wouldn't call Covid a cold or a mild flu. It is not a world killer, but is at a level massively beyond a bad flu. I'd say around 6 - 10 times a typical flu - and 2 - 3 times a very bad flu (on basic analysis). The real issue is that the flu is normally a big killer in areas such as Africa. And are massively estimated. Most of the perceived Covid deaths are not in Africa. 

By the way, his posts actually crack me up. 

17 hours ago, Maximus said:

Good post.    I see, and work around many like him.    Irrespective of the 'nutter' epithet, his - and others - fear is real.

They lack, as do many, the ability to analyse what they see and hear,  and consequently they tend to get the wrong end of the stick in many cases.   Your and Barryb's advice about punting, looking for value and points of difference, goes largely unheeded and misunderstood, so easy to comprehend how folk get led astray.

If you go looking, you can find a helluva lot of material posted on websites/blogs by people who seem to have a veneer  of respectability and education, and some of the material is pretty beguiling.

Me?  I just try and tread a  middle path, keep rational, and as my old man used to say ' does it smell right?'  because if it doesn't, it probably isn't.

The vaccine angst has been subsumed into an overall desperation over the path the Govt is taking, and every new conspiracy theory just fuels the fire, even if not really relevant.

So much of the fear and anxiety could have been avoided if the vaccine hadn't been 'forced' and instead, an alternative such as saliva testing/temperature checking had been allowed as well.  Wouldn't that have been preferable to seeing folk out of work and essential workers laid off?   Hospitals, short of resources already...?  just crazy.

[Freda]

Not sure how you came to be in my reply, Maxi !

Technology.

[Hesi]

11 hours ago, mardigras said:

It doesn't make much difference when you have people like Aquaman on another channel seriously on another planet.

He is the archetypal conspiracy theorist. Most others can't come close. His rare valid arguments are lost in his obsession. He's the kind of person that believes stuff simply because he reads it on one of his websites. 

I almost feel sympathy for the government's poor handling of things knowing they have to deal with the likes of that.

I agree that forcing people to vaccinate is absolutely the wrong move. But the idea that various elements are in the vaccine and it will kill more people than the virus is not supported by any real data. Vaccinating young people may also not be based on any science, but the claims of relative deaths are simply anecdotal.

But he uses those things to somehow push an argument that has no basis - rather than sticking to his stance of not wanting the vaccine.

I support his stance of not wanting the vaccine, as I say, it should be individual choice. But he is incapable of simply making that choice and feels the need to push theories that I haven't seen anything supporting them.

He thinks he has to make it about the vaccine is poison, kills more than the vaccine, contains harmful elements, is about a 'New World' order. He should wear an aluminium hat so he can easily be identified. That way his natural immunity will not be compromised.

I also love those people that look at the NZ situation as if that actually means anything from the point of view of the risks of the virus. He doesn't understand data, but supports data that aligns with his views. 

Anyone that looks more closely at the data, wouldn't call Covid a cold or a mild flu. It is not a world killer, but is at a level massively beyond a bad flu. I'd say around 6 - 10 times a typical flu - and 2 - 3 times a very bad flu (on basic analysis). The real issue is that the flu is normally a big killer in areas such as Africa. And are massively estimated. Most of the perceived Covid deaths are not in Africa. 

By the way, his posts actually crack me up. 

There are about 4 or 5 on there with similar extreme views, none of which have been backed up by any credible data.

The point for Pete and I is, that once such views start to take over a site and start getting rolled out on almost every thread, it turns a lot of people off.  It has seen the Harness section over there, decimated, with most choosing to come here.  Critical mass works both ways.

Racecafe has the same problem, with again, 4-5 with extremist posters, although they seem to have got on top of it now

People with such extreme views spend much much more time expressing them, than people with less extreme views.  I guess that is the tactic.

People mainly came on these sites to talk about racing topics, with a little bit of other stuff thrown in, not the other way around

 

[Globederby19]

Here's an interesting thought. Apparently the Omricon variant has arrived in Australia. Of course it was bought in by a Vaccinated person as the unvaccinated aren't allowed in. lol

[mardigras]

31 minutes ago, Globederby19 said:

Here's an interesting thought. Apparently the Omricon variant has arrived in Australia. Of course it was bought in by a Vaccinated person as the unvaccinated aren't allowed in. lol

That's just standard Globe. A major reason why vaccine mandates are unnecessary.

[Lightning Blue]

As winter hits Europe this week , the virus season gains 'momentum' once again. for example : France getting over 40,000 new cases a day (has 75% fully vaccinated population)  makes you wonder how effective the vaccination programs really are.?

Lots of Europe's countries are taking various lock-down measures again. 

I was hoping Australia would never have lock-downs again, after this disaster year (for some States) Oz at 80% vaccinated. But if it (vaccine) doesn't work against the strains and mutations ............ well seems will back to square one really?

[Globederby19]

Just now, mardigras said:

A major reason why vaccine mandates are unnecessary.

Its creating chaos here in Masterton. Two of our major chiropractitioners have closed down. Some bigger cafe outlets have done the same ,put staff off, and only open for pickup. I spent my last night at the RSA yesterday, and the Manager is pretty distraught as they are already struggling financially, have lost two of their best workers and need to employ someone to check everyone coming in the door, as do a lot of the businesses.

They had a business meeting in the Screening Room yest morning for all those like minded people running businesses and do not want to discriminate.  A speaker came over  from Wgtn. Still have to get the lowdown on the outcome .

[mardigras]

1 minute ago, Globederby19 said:

Its creating chaos here in Masterton. Two of our major chiropractitioners have closed down. Some bigger cafe outlets have done the same ,put staff off, and only open for pickup. I spent my last night at the RSA yesterday, and the Manager is pretty distraught as they are already struggling financially, have lost two of their best workers and need to employ someone to check everyone coming in the door, as do a lot of the businesses.

They had a business meeting in the Screening Room yest morning for all those like minded people running businesses and do not want to discriminate.  A speaker came over  from Wgtn. Still have to get the lowdown on the outcome .

The idea is insane. And to add to the woes - as you say, the compliance costs for the business escalates - and for what purpose?

[Globederby19]

9 minutes ago, mardigras said:

That's just standard Globe. A major reason why vaccine mandates are unnecessary.

Actually Mardi, I am in the same boat as you as far as having children in Melbourne, and eventually wanting to see them. But my son is of the same view and will not be vaccinated, so he also is beholden to the powers that be. Daniel Andrews finally got his emergency powers passed. I feel for the Victorian people.

[mardigras]

10 minutes ago, Lightning Blue said:

As winter hits Europe this week , the virus season gains 'momentum' once again. for example : France getting over 40,000 new cases a day (has 75% fully vaccinated population)  makes you wonder how effective the vaccination programs really are.?

Lots of Europe's countries are taking various lock-down measures again. 

I was hoping Australia would never have lock-downs again, after this disaster year (for some States) Oz at 80% vaccinated. But if it (vaccine) doesn't work against the strains and mutations ............ well seems will back to square one really?

Surely the governments have to be thinking of a new strategy if the vaccine doesn't provide them with reduced strain on medical services. I don't think case numbers are important.

Lockdowns aren't a long term option in my view. 

[mardigras]

2 minutes ago, Globederby19 said:

Actually Mardi, I am in the same boat as you as far as having children in Melbourne, and eventually wanting to see them. But my son is of the same view and will not be vaccinated, so he also is beholden to the powers that be. Daniel Andrews finally got his emergency powers passed. I feel for the Victorian people.

I think it is becoming a global issue around discrimination/segregation. Appalling.

[Freda]

23 minutes ago, mardigras said:

Surely the governments have to be thinking of a new strategy if the vaccine doesn't provide them with reduced strain on medical services. I don't think case numbers are important.

Lockdowns aren't a long term option in my view. 

I don't think there is much of that,  Mardi.  Thinking I mean.  I think most are bereft of ideas.

[karrotsishere]

On 11/30/2021 at 4:08 PM, karrotsishere said:

Many thanks guys. Will post in approx 48 hours if any effect or not.

Ok, so Day of Booster, nothing, not even a sore arm bar heart palpations. Next day within 24 hours of jab was having a bite to eat & water. Suddenly felt nausea, started to get ringing in ears. Stood up & walked to kitchen, to see if was actually nausea. Not sure why I did that. Was thinking oh no here we go side effects.

Woke up flat as a pancake on floor on my back, as opening eyes, was thinking am I dreaming, so hit my legs, am I on the floor on? How did I get here? Yes felt legs & yes to my amazement was on floor. Fainted. Never in my life have I fainted. I explained exactly what happened to her. Said still have ringing in ears, still have heart palpations, but they are not major e.g. not a racing heart & no chest pain. Was advised to rest & drink lots of fluid. And to keep monitoring my heart rate. If heart rate goes up over 100 to go see a doc.

This experience is guessing 1 in 100 or maybe 1 in 1000 (guess). However it is true & accurate & as I said Id advise feedback, I have advise. Good bad or otherwise. Might give an update tomorrow as the following 24 hours after the initial 24 hours. It has put me off wanting to get another Covid jab 

Edited December 18, 2021 by karrotsishere

[brown fox]

Sounds like the same symptons my uncle had after drinking his home brew😄

[ngakonui grass]

IKEA buys land at Sylvia park for their flagship shop.Thats on top of the Govt allowing them to buy 5500 hectares in the  

South Island for forestry.

Surely this is against this Govts policy on land sales to foreigners..

[PWJ]

51 minutes ago, karrotsishere said:

Ok, so Day of Booster, nothing, not even a sore arm bar heart palpations. Next day within 24 hours of jab was having a bite to eat & water. Suddenly felt nausea, started to get ringing in ears. Stood up & walked to kitchen, to see if was actually nausea. Not sure why I did that. Was thinking oh no here we go side effects.

Woke up flat as a pancake on floor on my back, as opening eyes, was thinking am I dreaming, so hit my legs, am I on the floor on? How did I get here? Yes felt legs & yes to my amazement was on floor. Fainted. Never in my life have I fainted. Rang Covid Healthline to report & advise what I should do & they recorded this against my name etc. A health professional called me back within 5 minutes. I explained exactly what happened to her. Said still have ringing in ears, still have heart palpations, but they are not major e.g. not a racing heart & no chest pain. Was advised to rest & drink lots of fluid. And to keep monitoring my heart rate. If heart rate goes up over 100 to go see a doc.

This experience is guessing 1 in 100 or maybe 1 in 1000 (guess). However it is true & accurate & as I said Id advise feedback, I have advise. Good bad or otherwise. Might give an update tomorrow as the following 24 hours after the initial 24 hours. It has put me off wanting to get another Covid jab 

Karrots, when I had my first shot (of AZ) I was fine for about 4 hours and then absolutely flattened by heart palpitations, falling blood pressure, incredible lassitude, so weak only a 4 metre journey to the toilet was all I was capable of. Any longer journey would have resulted in fainting (which I have never done in my life). The symptoms lasted for about 36 hours and then quickly alleviated. I consulted my GP who said that a very strong reaction - like mine - to the vaccine shows an incredibly strong immune system and would bode well for any future contact with the virus. My daughter, who is a geneticist, agreed.

The 2nd (booster) shot barely had any effect.

 

[karrotsishere]

1 hour ago, PWJ said:

Karrots, when I had my first shot (of AZ) I was fine for about 4 hours and then absolutely flattened by heart palpitations, falling blood pressure, incredible lassitude, so weak only a 4 metre journey to the toilet was all I was capable of. Any longer journey would have resulted in fainting (which I have never done in my life). The symptoms lasted for about 36 hours and then quickly alleviated. I consulted my GP who said that a very strong reaction - like mine - to the vaccine shows an incredibly strong immune system and would bode well for any future contact with the virus. My daughter, who is a geneticist, agreed.

The 2nd (booster) shot barely had any effect.

Thanks for sharing that PJ, has made me feel better. Not a nice experience is it. Think Im out the other end now.

[Maximus]

5 hours ago, Globederby19 said:

Here's an interesting thought. Apparently the Omricon variant has arrived in Australia. Of course it was bought in by a Vaccinated person as the unvaccinated aren't allowed in. lol

Surely all people are potential carriers of new variants. And Omicron may prove to be much less damaging than Delta; or it may lead to further mutations, one or more of which might wipe out millions. This is Mother Nature doing her thing. But you can't blame Governments globally for making decisions to minimise the risk of the most virulent known forms of Coronvirus. You just dont know what you just dont know.